R60 New Countryman owner with a question
#1
New Countryman owner with a question
I've had my base CM automatic for a few days and I have question about gas...
I previously owned a manual '05 MC convertible and faithfully filled it with shell premium gasoline. After 7 years I had no engine issues and attribute that to following manufacturer recommendations. I didn't even think about what kinda of gas my new Countryman would need and I would like it to last just like Baxter did.
I was reading through the book and it "recommends 91 but a minimum of 89. But that different grades of gas can be used for refueling".
So is mid-grade ok? Or do I need to stick with premium. I live in northern va and most of my driving is highway 95/495. I'm gonna go by the gas station I normally go to and see which number is which grade.
If it's best to use premium I will but if it legitimately isn't necessary than I'll buy mid grade.
I previously owned a manual '05 MC convertible and faithfully filled it with shell premium gasoline. After 7 years I had no engine issues and attribute that to following manufacturer recommendations. I didn't even think about what kinda of gas my new Countryman would need and I would like it to last just like Baxter did.
I was reading through the book and it "recommends 91 but a minimum of 89. But that different grades of gas can be used for refueling".
So is mid-grade ok? Or do I need to stick with premium. I live in northern va and most of my driving is highway 95/495. I'm gonna go by the gas station I normally go to and see which number is which grade.
If it's best to use premium I will but if it legitimately isn't necessary than I'll buy mid grade.
#3
Gasoline varies by season, station, refiner and octane level, from everything I've ever seen, if you use a lower grade and don't get knocking, you are fine, if it knocks go up to the next level. I check millage religiously and haven't noticed any difference in varying the grade.
MA suggested Shell or Exxon and premium. Owners manual suggest BP and both grades, don't sweat it and keep an ear out for pinging.
MA suggested Shell or Exxon and premium. Owners manual suggest BP and both grades, don't sweat it and keep an ear out for pinging.
#4
#6
When the manual states "minimum 89 octane", it is telling you that the engine computer, via knock-sensor signals, can adjust timing, mixture, etc. to keep the engine from knocking severely enough to cause damage. However these adjustments may reduce engine performance and efficiency a bit. If you drive moderately you may not be able to tell the difference.
#7
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#8
If you put 89 in an conventionally aspirated CM and you hear knocking, you are having REALLY BIG PROBLEMS. Stop driving and call your SA.
That said, the engine is designed for 89, so 91 or 93 wouldn't do anything for you.
Modern cars like the CM have computer-controlled timing. It shouldn't knock under any circumstances, though it may if you go below the minimum (as the earlier poster with the Countryman S reported). Never put in lower than the manufacturer's recommendations, as it will reduce performance and potentially cause problems despite the computer's best attempts to help. It may also void your warranty even if it's not the cause of a problem. For example, if your engine malfunctions, and you burn up your oil and your engine seizes due to something that has nothing to do with your octane but you've got a lower octane in there than recommended, they can try to blame the fuel to get out of paying.
But there's no reason to put in anything higher than recommended. It's a waste of money. I put 91 in my CM. Some stations have 93 instead, so I use that, but f I'm at some hoopity gas station with super-über premium gas, I'll skip it and go with the 91, as I don't believe it gives me any benefit.
I have a feeling somewhere in my brain that I'm giving my car a "special treat" by putting in excessively high octane gas, but it defies logic so I try to resist the urge. If I want to spoil my car, I'll vacuum it or wash the wheels or do something else that actually has a benefit.
That said, the engine is designed for 89, so 91 or 93 wouldn't do anything for you.
Modern cars like the CM have computer-controlled timing. It shouldn't knock under any circumstances, though it may if you go below the minimum (as the earlier poster with the Countryman S reported). Never put in lower than the manufacturer's recommendations, as it will reduce performance and potentially cause problems despite the computer's best attempts to help. It may also void your warranty even if it's not the cause of a problem. For example, if your engine malfunctions, and you burn up your oil and your engine seizes due to something that has nothing to do with your octane but you've got a lower octane in there than recommended, they can try to blame the fuel to get out of paying.
But there's no reason to put in anything higher than recommended. It's a waste of money. I put 91 in my CM. Some stations have 93 instead, so I use that, but f I'm at some hoopity gas station with super-über premium gas, I'll skip it and go with the 91, as I don't believe it gives me any benefit.
I have a feeling somewhere in my brain that I'm giving my car a "special treat" by putting in excessively high octane gas, but it defies logic so I try to resist the urge. If I want to spoil my car, I'll vacuum it or wash the wheels or do something else that actually has a benefit.
#9
Actually what Tippykayak said is not 100% correct. Under certain conditions your engine computer will continue to advance the ignition timing until the knock sensor detects pre-ignition. If you were to use higher octane fuel, you engine power output and fuel mileage would increase slightly, but not nearly enough that it would make any sense at all to pay the incremental cost of the higher octane fuel. For most the power increase would be noticeable only on a dyno. Conversely, if you were to use 87 octane and your knock sensor is working correctly, your computer would retard the timing before the human ear could hear the knocking, and no engine dmamge would result. But the reduced engine power would likely be noticeable under hard acceleration, and a decrease in fuel mileage, even in normal driving, would be measureable. Based on similar tests I've seen on other vehicles, it sounds like it might be in the 1 to 4 MPG range in our cars.
#10
hi sorry as a new owner i have two questions, i am sorry if they sound silly but i dont know where else to ask.
1) how on earth do i remove the centre rail accessory thing, i managed to remove the sunglass cover but cant remove the thing that is connected to the rail.
2) if i were to plug my usb charger for my blackberry into the usb spot, would it charge my phone?
thanks
1) how on earth do i remove the centre rail accessory thing, i managed to remove the sunglass cover but cant remove the thing that is connected to the rail.
2) if i were to plug my usb charger for my blackberry into the usb spot, would it charge my phone?
thanks
#12
hi sorry as a new owner i have two questions, i am sorry if they sound silly but i dont know where else to ask.
1) how on earth do i remove the centre rail accessory thing, i managed to remove the sunglass cover but cant remove the thing that is connected to the rail.
read the owners manual, the process is described clearly in the owners manual
2) if i were to plug my usb charger for my blackberry into the usb spot, would it charge my phone?
it charges my Treo 800w
thanks
1) how on earth do i remove the centre rail accessory thing, i managed to remove the sunglass cover but cant remove the thing that is connected to the rail.
read the owners manual, the process is described clearly in the owners manual
2) if i were to plug my usb charger for my blackberry into the usb spot, would it charge my phone?
it charges my Treo 800w
thanks
#13
Actually what Tippykayak said is not 100% correct. Under certain conditions your engine computer will continue to advance the ignition timing until the knock sensor detects pre-ignition. If you were to use higher octane fuel, you engine power output and fuel mileage would increase slightly, but not nearly enough that it would make any sense at all to pay the incremental cost of the higher octane fuel. For most the power increase would be noticeable only on a dyno. Conversely, if you were to use 87 octane and your knock sensor is working correctly, your computer would retard the timing before the human ear could hear the knocking, and no engine dmamge would result. But the reduced engine power would likely be noticeable under hard acceleration, and a decrease in fuel mileage, even in normal driving, would be measureable. Based on similar tests I've seen on other vehicles, it sounds like it might be in the 1 to 4 MPG range in our cars.
If you're making the argument that putting 93 in an engine designed for 91 might give you extra power that's measurable by sensitive instruments but is completely undetectable by a human driver, I really have no idea, but I wasn't commenting on that, and if it's not detectable by me in real-world driving, I'm not fussed about it.
Don't forget that we were talking about conventionally aspirated CMs as well as CM-S models, which have different octane recommendations.
As one poster noted earlier, putting 87 in a CM-S caused audible knocking. I'm not surprised, as the recommendation is 89 at a minimum. The computer might be able to prevent knocking anyway, but under hard acceleration, I'm not surprised that the it became audible.
Putting 87 in a conventionally aspirated CM should not cause knocking, as it is the recommended minimum because the engine is designed to handle it.
So can you be a bit clearer as to where I'm incorrect? I always like to learn more about engines.
#14
Once you pop off the accessory, the rail mount has a recessed plastic lever you can flip up. It's on the side of the mount, parallel to the rail. Flip it up, and the mount comes free.
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