Drivetrain M7's own Super-AGS thread
#176
Randy:
After five minutes of squinting, It looks in the range of 20 or so.........regardless of other people's supposed agendas, even a 15 ft-lb. increase would raise my eyebrows.
Were there multiple pulls done? If so, did they also show sizeable gains between 2500 and 2800 rpms?
After five minutes of squinting, It looks in the range of 20 or so.........regardless of other people's supposed agendas, even a 15 ft-lb. increase would raise my eyebrows.
Were there multiple pulls done? If so, did they also show sizeable gains between 2500 and 2800 rpms?
#177
Before a war of words is started...may I ask this please.
Can the sheet be recreated using say Red/Blue for the Super AGS run and 2 contrasting colors to the Red/Blue for the stock run.
I think with both runs being the same colors there is a bit of confusion as to how all this is to be read.
I drew 2 lines on the existing graph above, A and B
What is being compared. Is A the delta or is B the delta.
Last edited by gnatster; 05-31-2008 at 07:42 PM.
#178
Before a war of words is started...may I ask this please.
Can the sheet be recreated using say Red/Blue for the Super AGS run and 2 contrasting colors to the Red/Blue for the stock run.
I think with both runs being the same colors there is a bit of confusion as to how all this is to be read.
I drew 2 lines on the existing graph above, A and B
What is being compared. Is A the delta or is B the delta.
#179
No conspiracy here...just trying to make it an easier to read tool for all.
#183
my question about the graph is up top about where tq and hp cross. it's hard to tell which line is which after that (before below after or after below before)
#185
I agree with you . Was not our choice .
Randy
M7 Tuning
#187
yeah, we got that. that's not what I'm talking about. red touches red and blue touches blue (or maybe crosses it). Gnatster asked for a new graph showing four color resolution, not two colors as shown. As Randy said, not possible.
#188
I agree though....using the same colors makes it a bit hard to read when they overlap. The dyno guy should probably rethink that
#190
Randy:
It's more in the range of 25. At roughly 2700 rpm, I'm getting about 165 stock and 190 modified.
Again, not to be a broken record, but it would help to see the second and third pulls to see if this is a trend or an anomaly.
It's more in the range of 25. At roughly 2700 rpm, I'm getting about 165 stock and 190 modified.
Again, not to be a broken record, but it would help to see the second and third pulls to see if this is a trend or an anomaly.
#191
It is in the 25 range (a little more it seems) at 2800....I threw it into a graphics program and did the measurements to just check it out.
#192
Randy
M7 Tuning
#193
Most of the benefits of having a free flowing intake are at high RPM's where the additional airflow actually matters. The car isn't even sucking enough air in at 2800 RPM's to see those kinds of gains. Interestingly enough, where you SHOULD be seeing gains (High RPM's, where the engine is ingesting exponentially more air as the RPM's rise) the stock intake actually seems to be outperforming your unit.
Last edited by Guest; 06-02-2008 at 08:40 AM.
#194
Reading is really hard
#195
I read it just fine. There are 4 possibilities here:
1) They're Lying... or at best using deceptive marketing to sell their products
2) The Dyno was run wrong, why they didn't do more than one run I can't say...
3) The car is a statistical anomaly (rather like the RMW cars that gain 50 whp from a tune, or 2-3 whp)
4) BMW/Peugeot completely dropped the ball with the R56 and left 25+ lb-ft of torque off the table because they didn't want to make the air filter slightly larger (That sounds much more plausible).
If M7 figured out some insane backdoor into the R56 via sticking an air filter on the car, I think it deserves more explanation (If they wish to be taken seriously) than just "Woo, here's our graph" at 1997 CRT screen resolution with every plot line the same color...
Every time I do something to MY car that I pay for I'm shilling (Because I found a vendor that sells parts that actually work, I track my car, I know they work!).
Every time I ask questions about radical claims of power from seemingly insignificant parts (Plasma booster? Throttle Body? Air filters? Spark plug wires?) I'm stirring up trouble. God forbid I don't believe everything every vendor says after spending close to 8k with installation at various vendors and "Tuners" and making less than 190 whp.
I've given up trying to post about things anymore, people can spend their money on whatever they want. Maybe after wasting as much as I did on things that don't do anything they'll start reading old posts...
1) They're Lying... or at best using deceptive marketing to sell their products
2) The Dyno was run wrong, why they didn't do more than one run I can't say...
3) The car is a statistical anomaly (rather like the RMW cars that gain 50 whp from a tune, or 2-3 whp)
4) BMW/Peugeot completely dropped the ball with the R56 and left 25+ lb-ft of torque off the table because they didn't want to make the air filter slightly larger (That sounds much more plausible).
If M7 figured out some insane backdoor into the R56 via sticking an air filter on the car, I think it deserves more explanation (If they wish to be taken seriously) than just "Woo, here's our graph" at 1997 CRT screen resolution with every plot line the same color...
Every time I do something to MY car that I pay for I'm shilling (Because I found a vendor that sells parts that actually work, I track my car, I know they work!).
Every time I ask questions about radical claims of power from seemingly insignificant parts (Plasma booster? Throttle Body? Air filters? Spark plug wires?) I'm stirring up trouble. God forbid I don't believe everything every vendor says after spending close to 8k with installation at various vendors and "Tuners" and making less than 190 whp.
I've given up trying to post about things anymore, people can spend their money on whatever they want. Maybe after wasting as much as I did on things that don't do anything they'll start reading old posts...
#196
I read it just fine. There are 4 possibilities here:
1) They're Lying... or at best using deceptive marketing to sell their products
2) The Dyno was run wrong, why they didn't do more than one run I can't say...
3) The car is a statistical anomaly (rather like the RMW cars that gain 50 whp from a tune, or 2-3 whp)
4) BMW/Peugeot completely dropped the ball with the R56 and left 25+ lb-ft of torque off the table because they didn't want to make the air filter slightly larger (That sounds much more plausible).
1) They're Lying... or at best using deceptive marketing to sell their products
2) The Dyno was run wrong, why they didn't do more than one run I can't say...
3) The car is a statistical anomaly (rather like the RMW cars that gain 50 whp from a tune, or 2-3 whp)
4) BMW/Peugeot completely dropped the ball with the R56 and left 25+ lb-ft of torque off the table because they didn't want to make the air filter slightly larger (That sounds much more plausible).
I don't believe the huge dyno numbers either.....but I'm not gonna just jump to the conclusion that Nardo must be lying and start posting it here as a "fact".
I've given up trying to post about things anymore, people can spend their money on whatever they want. Maybe after wasting as much as I did on things that don't do anything they'll start reading old posts...
Last edited by Rally@StanceDesign; 06-02-2008 at 10:02 AM.
#197
Every time I ask questions about radical claims of power from seemingly insignificant parts (Plasma booster? Throttle Body? Air filters? Spark plug wires?) I'm stirring up trouble. God forbid I don't believe everything every vendor says after spending close to 8k with installation at various vendors and "Tuners" and making less than 190 whp.
#198
I took off the Super-AGS to put my Homemade CAI during this weekend (Americade Weekend here in upstate NY) and noticed that the Super-AGS was rubbing on the bottom and also had some serious heat soak. I had to let it cool for about 10 minutes to remove it (too hot to touch) outside temp was in the low 90's. Anyone that installed their Super-AGS have this problem
#199
I took off the Super-AGS to put my Homemade CAI during this weekend (Americade Weekend here in upstate NY) and noticed that the Super-AGS was rubbing on the bottom and also had some serious heat soak. I had to let it cool for about 10 minutes to remove it (too hot to touch) outside temp was in the low 90's. Anyone that installed their Super-AGS have this problem
#200
From the Super-AGS to my Homemade CAI I did notice some low end torque loss via my butt dyno, but the sound from the Homemade CAI was five times louder than the Super-AGS and fifty times louder than stock