Thought the same thing. It is the ECU controlling the waste gate.

 

Scott, I used the Forge BPV as per my sig.

The ECU can still absolutely retard timings and essentially stall the engine for a brief period, causing boost loss.

If you need to see what I mean, I have several videos of the events....

 

Very interesting conversation, gents. I very much enjoy learning from you, Theta and Scott.

I was going to pose the same question as you, Scott: If you installed a mechanical valve (e.g., Alta) instead of an electronic one (factory), would it help stave off boost loss?

Also, one other question: What if I kept the car in manual mode and shifted with the stick? Would it negate the issue?

 

haha

wondered when you would jump in!

scott

 

Yup! Only a matter of time. Been crazy busy at work this week, so just trying to catchup on all the posts I missed. Was hoping I'd come back to find that the DoS intake was done, but alas it's not.

 

Heya, Hujan!

As I wrote to Scott, the Forge BPV is also mechanical, and would act the same as the Alta. The throttle was being cut, causing backpressure to open the mechanical valve and purge the boost.

I would happily send you the same thing I sent Scott if you'd like.

 

What up, Theta!

That's too bad about the throttle being cut. If you don't mind, I'm sure I'd enjoy reading the long version.

 

Sign me up too Theta! I'd like the bigger and longer explanation!

 

PMs sent.

 

Very interesting.

Are you fairly convinced that all that was due to the increased HP and TQ and not some changes to shift points or something?

If it is all due to the increased HP and TQ tripping out the torque converter in the auto trans (as I suspect), do you think there's a ceiling (in terms of HP and TQ numbers) that us auto guys can stay below without triggering such issues?

Also, while we're at it, what is the difference between a "Stage 1" and "Stage 2" tune? It seems to be mod dependent insofar as you only become eligible for a higher stage with more radical modifications.

But I'd always assumed that with the self-adjusting ECU, the stages were unnecessary? And if the tune files are written differently, what changes?

For example, if I tune through Renntech and tell them I have an Akrapovic DP, aftermarket FMIC, 2.75" exhaust, and an intake, are they going to write a different tune file that might be roughly equivalent to, say, NM's Stage 2?

 

Yes, it had nothing to do with the transmission programming, as there was nothing done to the TCM portion.

As you could see, it was based in the tq. delivered, etc. Once we went over 255 and 1.5 bar, it was just a nightmare. Again, fine for manual guys. It's just an auto problem.

Stage 1 does not require a FMIC. Stage 2 absolutely requires a FMIC. It's all about timing advancing - the more timing, the hotter it gets...

The best bet is to talk to the tuners and let them know your concerns and mods up front. For the most part, they're not going to push anybody past a certain line unless they know they're able to deal with problems, etc.

I specifically asked for something that was too hot for my car's transmission to handle. This is the main reason I went to the JCW manual platform, as I'm aiming for 300lb/ft.

 

So, in a nutshell, the difference between a Stage 1 and Stage 2 tune is the ignition timing advance? I just always thought the ECU would advance the timing if it could (i.e., if it was cooler day and/or you had a bigger FMIC and/or water-meth injection, etc.).

For reference, how much torque were you putting down when you were having issues?

I'd love to tune with Jan, but getting ahold of him is tough. Assuming I won't be able to get him to do it, RennTech is my next bet.

 

Tuning is all about editing the fueling tables and ignition timings. At the base level of any gas-powered engine, more air and fuel equals hotter explosions, and the byproduct is more power generated per stroke.

If the ECU was able to vastly alter the fueling and timing tables, there would be no need for ECU tunes, now would there?

The ECU can severely retard timings, but the limits for advance are pretty strict. Same with fueling. If it was all an ECU-learn, we would just keep modding to the sky and it would scale nicely.

The level where the transmission started getting to be a pain in the *** was the 250-255 wtq range. The ALL4 system is good to 600wtq, so that's not the weak link.

RENNtech has a single tune, but a neat design with putting most of the power underneath the guise of the Sport button. NM has great tuning, as well. The Auto just holds us back from going hog-wild with the R60. Probably has a lot to do with weight, as well.

 

That all makes sense to me. Thank you for the explanation.

Looking at these numbers for the RENNtech tune, it looks like those of us with autos would still be okay based on your experience.

Stock Performance for Cooper S N18: 181 HP / 192 TQ
Modified Performance for Cooper S N18: 221 HP, 232 TQ

That's the part where I get confused. If I understand you right, a Stage 2 tune will be more aggressive with such things as timing advance, on the assumption that the car can take it due to a larger intercooler, etc.

But if RENNtech only has one tune, why are they so insistent that you specify the mods you have? Is it because they will write a tune map that is a bit more aggressive (Stage 1+ ?) if I tell them I have a DP and an aftermarket FMIC?

 

I think that may, indeed, be the case. I will be using them for my next tune, as I believe NM is not yet able to tune the 2013s.

Since they very much want to know what mods you have, I think it might be safe to assume they will tailor the "one tune" to you instead of breaking it up into stages.

 

Makes sense. Thanks for answering all my questions, Theta. I appreciate your patience!

Now all I need to do is figure out if I'm going to do with my intake setup before I get a tune since, unfortunately, it looks like the DoS kit is still a long way from coming to fruition. Probably just a drop-in panel filter from AFE in the meantime.

 

Of course - that's what we're all here for.

You can go with any of the open-element kits as a hold-over, or use a panel filter. OR, if you're adventurous, you can try this cheap (but neat) idea: http://www.coopercrap.com/cc-cai-per...e-intakes.html

Not tried it, but could be a cheap fill-in!

 

If you decide to go with NM's tune, just giving you a heads up that they recommend that we use a cone filter type compared to the drop in panel filter because the intake helps flow the tune better. I was close to going back to the drop in filter til they told me about it. Good luck!

 

^ ^ Very true. Remember that open-element will flow better. Temps are a non-issue with a larger IC.

 

Jerry at NM Said once they get a look at the auto JCW ECU they might be able to figure out a work around with the auto tranny issue.

 

That's great news!

 

Hi guys,

New registered user but reading NAM since a while now and just read the whole thread, really great by the way. Here's little context:

I’m from Mexico City and I used to own a 2012 hardtop JCW (N14 engine) with some mods on it: Alta FMIC, hot side boost tube, 3” no restrictions turboback (massive sound), panel air filter and AccessPort among other non-relevant mods to this thread.

I sold the ’12 JCW to get a ‘13hardtop GP since I basically track the car (not daily driven), but the bummer is that the GP has the N18 engine, what brings me here.

Comments
1.- I’m assuming the GP engine is the standard N18 that all the 2011up models have, I’m not 100% sure, but I don’t think BMW/Mini will develop something exclusively for 2000 cars. At least I’m hoping so…

2.- Canned AP maps don’t work well for Mexican models, this because our cars are a blend between USDM/EUDM specs, this and the high elevation in Mexico City caused boosting issues (“Reduced Engine Power” in the visual boost screen), emission control CEL (lots of codes), and just the map not working properly. Alta’s support guy, Jeff Perrin gave me excellent support and worked with me like 5 different maps over time to ensure it worked well in city/track (finally it worked well). Other guy had same issues with RMW and still struggling with them.

I’m thinking in NM remap, but having to send the ECU back and forward from Mexico to get a right tune makes me think a lot about it I will talk with Jerry about my case and see what happens.

DOUBTS:
I’m thinking to install turboback, FMIC without having a remap, I’m hoping to have some better performance, because I feel the car really, really slow compared to the previous moded JCW. I know that the real gain of these mods comes along with the remap, but what do you guys think?

My Research:
ALTA/Cobb: Has no intention whatsoever to develop something for the N18 or even continue doing so for the N14, AP in ALTA and Cobb web pages is no longer there. This due the “bad business” it represents, this confirmed by Jeff Perrin when I asked for maps for the N18.

Evolve: Last time I asked (a month ago), they answered me that no remap was available, I will need to check again to see if they cracked the 2013

I just realize I wrote a damn bible, sorry about that and thanks for reading it

 

having seen all he paceman photos floating about, if mini cancelled the countryman and made a 4-door paceman, i would sell my countryman and get a 4-door paceman

scott

 

They should create a tune that you can control and modify with an app on your smartphone using the Bluetooth!!!!!! Or do they already have one?

 

That's never going to happen on an N18. Ever.