Sorry if that came off worse than I meant it -- was just supposed to be informative to others who read into the Evolve post.

Don't forget NM on the 2011/2012s - very viable and a great tuning solution.

The '13 ECUs removed some of the JTAG, including the VCC point. Kind of a mystery as to how the tuners are getting in anymore (NM doesn't have the ability yet, among others).

I'll PM you about the CAI!

 

No worries. It probably needed to be clarified. I continue to be dumbfounded by the steps they take to prevent tuning. An argument could be made that it is a violation of our rights as consumers to have anything less than unrestricted access to our ECUs, though perhaps that's just the class-action lawyer in me.

Keepin' my eyes peeled for the PM. Good to hear from you, Theta.

 

It won't work since they can claim the software is the property of AG, Siemens, etc. I wish it wasn't that way, though!

 

Ok, so I plan to go straight to NM stage 2...since it has about the same gains as the Renntech tune but for only $500...also to Rob I have a DDM RIS and I like it but I want to switch to a DoS. So I was wondering what the Dyno numbers quoted for Evolve were since there are none posted on the first page and I don't see any anywhere...if the numbers are significantly more than a stage 2 NM tune I might be considering them...

 

Go for DoS!!!

 

Thank you for clearing that up, I didnt know that was information from ETG, from reading past posts, it seems like that was a piece of secondhand info that was just passed on. What if they are right, and you just dont have/want a DP? Would you feel safe then?

I mean dont get me wrong, it does seem king of unsettling that they would develop a tune that causes overboost issues at all, and push numbers that other companies cant (or maybe wont?).

In the end I dont have the kind of money to be taking risks with a tune for extra hp, and will probably end up going NM unless there is some crucial piece of info that would change my mind. Or if I get the money to just drive an hour to Renntech

 

So I have been just sitting by my computer trying to figure out numbers with the tuners I like. If I go stage 1 with NM, I can see roughly 200ish whp, am I correct?

 

Pretty easy to just go to there website...so easy I did it for you

The answer is no, around 185. And I wouldn't get a catless down pipe either, unless u can open source the tune. You'll run too rich, overboost and cause more carbon build up and the O2 sensor won't read correctly unless you go wideband

http://www.nm-eng.com/media/attachments/269_r56dyno.pdf

 

some quotes from my phone conversation with Jags from ETG:

"the only thing we sell is the tune, we do not sell parts"

"we have developed an N18 tune that gives you +40 hp and +60 torque with the only mods required being an upgraded FMIC and a drop in high flow panel air filter or other closed intake ... making our tune the best value to the you"

"a dp back aftermarket exhaust has little effect on the tune, but sounds nice"

"if you want to use an aftermarket DP, i will need to adjust the tune to avoid a potential overboost condition and CELs, but the gains will be the same as with the stock DP"

"we have seen no problems with the stock diverter valve, but if you feel the need to upgrade we suggest the forge piston style recirculation valve, do not use the blowoff version"

"there is no reason to remove the intercooler resonator unless you want to hear the noise"

hope this clears up the ETG tune situation

i was going to get a renntech tune, but after speaking to Jags, a dry foam airfilter, a tyrolsport FMIC, an ETG tune and i am done

scott

EDIT:

Jags confirmed he can tune ALL N18 ECUs

 

Agreed. Seems like a viable option, and a good one at that. Jags seems to know the engine, and isn't simply offering a canned tune the way seem are making out to be.

Bmwr606, when do you think you are gonna make the jump?

 

i was ready to order my FMIC and filter, but my work p/u (1997 gmc sonoma, 290,000 miles) started running rough and threw a long list of codes 2 weeks ago ... AND it needs an emission test this month to renew the tags

illinios has an "exemption clause" for the emissions test ... have to spend $450 trying to clear the codes, but the catch 22 is it has to be worked on by a "certified repair shop", not by the owner

it's in the shop now ... fate unknown ... bill unknown

should know monday, then i will know when i can upgrade the cms all4

scott

 

This is very helpful info, thank you!!

 

Does anyone know if Jerry and the boys at NM are working on; or even thinking of pursuing, a post mid-2012 N18 ECU tune?
Or will that be something we'll never see from NM...and we shouldn't even think of waiting?

 

Ughh, now I'm on the fence cause it means I will have to put my stock air box on after I removed the air duct from the air box since it was loose. I guess I will shoot ETG a call then see what's up.

 

If you want this answer, just fracking CALL HIM!

805-388-7171

 

Looks like Evolve is out. Here's the email I got back from them:

 

+1

 

Just spoke to Jags,

I am sold. I am going to him, ETG. Sometime in april I will have his tune on my car. Considering I don't need a silly DP like others have suggested, and a DV.
I will install my exhaust, sell my intake and go back to stock, and install my FMIC too with the hot side and I am set.

I definitely consider anyone with a 2012-2013 to go to him, he told me those can be tuned. Good luck guys!

 

I agree with everything you've said except the "silly DP" comment... that's a bit offensive.

This tuner doesn't like to tune with it, but it's an obvious restriction that has been proven over years of data collection (since the R56 launch in 2007) to be a point of power loss.

Replacing the downpipe is, to the contrary, not silly at all. This tuner seems to have an issue with his maps not being friendly with the higher flow. There's nothing wrong with that, so long as you're comfortable with the rest of the tune. However, to each their own!

 

Theta

i find it interesting that ETG has found 40 hp & 60 torque with the stock DP and are satisfied that their tune is more cost effective for the end user

wonder what they could do with a higher flow DP?

scott

 

I'm not going to start a war here, I'm just not on the side of calling an obvious restriction removal "silly".

Numbers are wonderful, but we have so few dyno sheets/results that anyone can claim just about anything these days, and that's a fact.

NM had a tune running so hot (race-only 93-100 octane) on mine that it was nearly stupid - it also caused issues with the Auto, etc. Excellent power, but at a hell of a price. They have since discontinued that offering. I applaud them for taking it that far with me - we were at +80ftlb at the time.

Never in my life (or as a tuner) have I seen a turbo application NOT benefit from a downpipe/catalytic converter swap. I'm not a fan of test pipes, but it's simple science that backs the support of the downpipe swap.

Again, I'm just basing off fact. I don't especially care what numbers get thrown around. Line up 3 JCWs all tuned with the different tunes, same parts, and on the same day, and we'll have a fair set of results.

However, since this is never going to happen, this is one big d**k measuring contest without a ruler.

 

Theta sorry if I offended you or anyone else about the DP. I wanted one and I still may get one if this guy ETG tuned with a DP works out. He's basically their test dummy. But it's funny how NM had trouble with making an auto produce more power but ETG confidently said they've done autos with 40hp/60tq without any issues.

Again if this guy with a MINI runs the DP with no issue, I will eventually test it out myself but I will be selling my intake soon for those who want it, check the marketplace soon.

 

I don't think you offended anyone.


.....just be careful with these folks. Almost every tuner has been able to get better numbers when a customer moves to something higher flowing.....so the fact that these guys are saying it doesn't do much to have one is enough to throw caution to the wind.

You seem to be getting quick responses from them...ask them why the car would overboost from a high flow or catless DP with their tune.

Tuners who have worked with those (DP's) have never reported the issue ETG is.

 

It's okay - I know your heart was in the right place, just throwing a differen perspective out there one why DPs are important.

Every tuner is different, and they have their own maps that they're happy with. I think NM can squeeze +50tq out of a stage 1, but again... the numbers are arbitrary.

As far as the intake goes... I absolutely love the sound, but the stock intake with a quality filter is a true CAI that works VERY well. No shame in going back to that!

 

^^ I agree with NewCooper's statement.