When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
I once saw a dumpster hauler that the guy had fabricated a frame for that would hold a car. The car was driven up on the frame, strapped in and loaded on the truck just the same as a dumpster would have been, and the same for offloading. Quite the sight to see this being done. I also saw a motorcycle loader for a pickup truck that was a frame with 4 large screw jacks that would raise and lower it. When it is raised, the pickup would then be backed up under it, in much the same fashion as loading a slide in pickup camper. There are a lot of ways to do this...
I am looking forward to your solution. I know with you it wil be creative.
I once saw a dumpster hauler that the guy had fabricated a frame for that would hold a car. The car was driven up on the frame, strapped in and loaded on the truck just the same as a dumpster would have been, and the same for offloading. Quite the sight to see this being done. I also saw a motorcycle loader for a pickup truck that was a frame with 4 large screw jacks that would raise and lower it. When it is raised, the pickup would then be backed up under it, in much the same fashion as loading a slide in pickup camper. There are a lot of ways to do this...
I am looking forward to your solution. I know with you it wil be creative.
Having been driving on the tracks it is always eye opening to see the smart ideas other people have, no matter the budget.
We just had a three-day club days and I set out with a relaxed attitude. I have a list of achievable goals including shaking down the RXC, as well as to conduct a go-no-go test loading it onto the Trailex trailer. Having loading it once with 4 able bodies and with 2 floor jacks, I was able to use that experience to better design a solution, with the help with the dimension drawings of the car. Here is a teaser photo taken at the end of the last day.
I anticipated the most difficult is preventing the car from high centering at the apex where the ramps meet the trailer deck. However before I invested into three sets of Race Ramps I did some simple trigonometry calculations and determined I need to aim for 5-degrees or less of angles.
for this go-no-go exercise I use the manual winch to pull the car up the gentle ramp with my track buddy helped steer the car to within 1/2" accuracy; my design is to aim for being to load and unload the car unaided
The trailer deck is about 24" high. To achieve circa 5-degree of slope transitions I need about 23 feet of ramp. The trailer's ramps are 11 feet and with a 5% and 11.5 ft Race Ramp it is the most likely and cost effective solution that might work. It worked.
Here are some photos I took of the three day club days. The first and the third days were really hot of over 92 F. I set out to pace myself and had a list of objectives of sorting out the Lotus O2 sensors lean DTCs, conduct the go, no-go prove of concepts of the solutions to utilize my existing trailer to haul the Radical RXC, familiarizing myself with the RXC, to conduct a shake down of the car, and begin the long learning of driving this race car.
this has to be the longest car trailer that I've ever seen
his lady is the best female driver I'd encounter on track and she has a well sorted boosted MX5 NB
my lobster, clam, and smoked pork shoulder pasta dish
even before taking the RXC out I encounter what I suspected a coolant overheating problem but I could not be sure
I brought the shop vacuum specifically to blow out over 5 lbs of gravel the car tires picked up and deposit onto the aero body panels; the gravels were picked up between the garage and the paddock by the slicks
I trailer the Lotus to test out what I believe the cause of the O2 sensor lean DTCs; the verification test could not be conducted on public road conditions
this is the most expensive rig and it carries a brand new GT2 RS Weissach edition
in descending order of price stickers from right to left
I consulted the dealer and proceeded to remove the front body cover to bleed the radiators of trapped air; it was short by close to a gallon of coolant
the all business interior
and this car rides worst than a 30s truck
a very posh interior of the GT2 RS that pampers you even on track
they are all my buddies now
more club member buddies; the red BMW blew a limited slip diff the first day; his mechanic brought in a replacement that night, and by the next day he is back out again
while this is not the Radical that I first encounter, this was the one that piqued my interest and led to the purchase; this is a RS8 with the V8
it has very spatant interior as it is a smaller car
my calculation was very exact and the front air dam barely rubs the ramps; I will cut a couple pieces of 3/4" plywood to raise the front wheel and the problem is solved
my 23' long aggregate 5 degree ramps
my Mini track buddy help me steer the car up the ramp while I worked the manual winch; I have not invest or install an electric winch until I know I do not need to buy the Futura car trailer
my other club buddy in this <$3,000 Lotus Elise is one of the best drivers; he bought a brand new Radical Rapture only a couple of days after mine from the same dealer
the widest track of the car is only 1" or so narrower than the width of the trailer deck
this is the most amazing compact motorhome; I can carry 3 sets of Race Ramps in the upper berth ; it turns out I only need the 11' long 11" rise set if I have a level ground to load and unload the car from the trailer; I have two small set in case I need to raise the front wheels to prevent the center of the car from being high centered as it go over the apex of the ramp and the trailer deck
there is even this safety net to prevent the ramps from sliding and fall out of the upper berth
I completed the go no-go test of proving out the trailer solution for the Radical with flying colors. I have not receive the hardware for the tiedown solution yet but I know that is a slam dunk and so is installing an electric winch so I can load and unload the car without a second set of hands.
As you can see the compact motorhome in conjunction with the Trailex trailer make the most versatile race car carrier with the most compact footprint, size, and weight. The story don't just end here. I will set up a high pressure air system to support the air jacks of the Radical which requires 400 PSI of pressure.
I also successfully tested out the troubleshooting of the O2 sensors lean DTC of the Lotus. I drove the Radical by breaking it in per the owner's handbook, in which one of the most important is to work-harden the gear faces by varying the loading incrementally. I spun the car twice but stayed on the track, and I learnt how unforgiving the car is. In all, I hit all the goals for the track event and solved the overheating problem before it cause expensive damage.
Got to love these MINI build threads. You never know what direction some of them will go...
You may have need for a little more of leveling if not on a level surface. I saw this yesterday. Note the ramps under the trucks rear wheels to raise up the front of the trailer...
Got to love these MINI build threads. You never know what direction some of them will go...
You may have need for a little more of leveling if not on a level surface. I saw this yesterday. Note the ramps under the trucks rear wheels to raise up the front of the trailer...
Raised rear...
Thanks for sharing that photo.
Included in my incremental plan to tackle the trailering challenges, I entertained of adding air springs to the rear of the Sprinter to achieve similar result, but with more expense and fineness. I would only do that if I need a couple inches of trailer tongue lift to help with the ramp angle. I would had bought a set only the the one for this Sprinter is not so expensive and hard to find. Additionally the Sprinter "frame" is not designed to handle the stress without improvised reinforcement so one would only treat it as helper spring at most, in addition to using it only to raise the rear end slightly for loading/unloading purposes.
Car like this is designed to be supported by a race team, including pit crew and a race engineer, and with more equipment than the little RV can carry. Here are some of the other challenges that I mapped out.
High pressure air supply for the air jacks, and tie down track system:
there is just barely enough storage space left to carry this 60 cu ft or a 22 cu ft nitrogen aluminum cylinder
a 400 PSI regulator
a 400 PSI working pressure air hose
I am going with the VersaTie tie down track system
this idler is the key to address the low ride height and confined trailer deck space
I plan to use the trailer's current anchoring points for the ratchet straps. The four idlers will guide and hole the straps low horizontally along the deck surface towards the anchoring points.
I also thought of you when I saw someone loading their race car into their enclosed trailer with an electric winch with a remote. Couldn’t see if it was wireless. But I figure, you are already into that one....
A thought... if the biggest issue now is high siding the car when going from the ramps onto the trailer, then what about a couple of jacks (like floor jack) at the ground end of the ramps and use those to raise that end of the ramps to cut the angle to the trailer?
I also thought of you when I saw someone loading their race car into their enclosed trailer with an electric winch with a remote. Couldn’t see if it was wireless. But I figure, you are already into that one....
A thought... if the biggest issue now is high siding the car when going from the ramps onto the trailer, then what about a couple of jacks (like floor jack) at the ground end of the ramps and use those to raise that end of the ramps to cut the angle to the trailer?
I bought 2 sets of short 5-degrees to use in case the center of the car needs to be raise to avoid high centering. You can see a set by the generator in this photo. To use them I put a set with the vertical end to vertical end making a up and down ramp for each front wheel. On this perfectly flat paddock I didn't need to us these secondary ramps. All three sets of Race Ramps can be stored in the upper berth of the motorhome.
Ideally wireless remote would be best for the winch as I need to be at far as over 40' from the winch to steer the car. Wired remote simply don't come that long, unless I modify one. I actually plan to try out the cheapo China made $90 Warn ATV winch first with a wired remote and only buy a Warn 4000 should that fails to work.
I know you talked about air bags on the tow rig, but a much easier, less expensive, more mechanically simple option is to beef up the tongue jack on the trailer to increase the nose height and reduce the breakover angle. With a stout, well mounted jack, you can not only take all the weight off the tow rig rear suspension but also stretch it to close to full rebound height. Should buy you 4-6 inches. I have used that a lot with my enclosed trailers to solve that same breakover angle issue.
Still bummed that your ramps work. I wanted to see your new rig. I have to believe the way you solved your driveway repair space issue and your itch for a little better race car performance issue (than Desire offered), your solution to an upgraded trailer and tow rig would be palatial.
Hope you are safe from fires, and only exercising the mini ladder truck for training purposes.
I know you talked about air bags on the tow rig, but a much easier, less expensive, more mechanically simple option is to beef up the tongue jack on the trailer to increase the nose height and reduce the breakover angle. With a stout, well mounted jack, you can not only take all the weight off the tow rig rear suspension but also stretch it to close to full rebound height. Should buy you 4-6 inches. I have used that a lot with my enclosed trailers to solve that same breakover angle issue.
Still bummed that your ramps work. I wanted to see your new rig. I have to believe the way you solved your driveway repair space issue and your itch for a little better race car performance issue (than Desire offered), your solution to an upgraded trailer and tow rig would be palatial.
Hope you are safe from fires, and only exercising the mini ladder truck for training purposes.
I don't want to put too much stress on the trailer by lifting up the tongue too far beyond the intended front back tilt of the tandem axles. increasing the ramp lengths are the proper way to utilize this trailer. I saw air bags only as secondary provision should the ramps still fall short but they don't. I only invested in the long ramps after I reasonably certain that I can load and carry them on the upper berth.
While the longest Futura trailer may be the alternative solution and would save the precious space of the upper berth for other use, I have reservation of the reliability of the raisable deck using steel cables and pulleys. I have to drive over significant stretch of gravel roads with fine volcanic silt. The silt would clog up the cable/pulley system and when they are seized up with a car on it I can envision the unpleasant task of trying to fix them.
I don't know why I didn't post this photo showing the end to end length of the rig loading the car.
the end to end length is about 70 feet not including the extra space to get the Radical into position to be winched up
Life used to be so simple when I just drive Desire from the house less than 15 miles to PIR. Once you stepped onto the slippery slope the grade angle increased for your merry ride down and before you realize you are over the deep end into the abyss of no return.
I use several of those tricks, I have ramps for the back wheels of my truck and a electric winch with wireless remote so I can guide the car and winch at the same time
The only benefit that I can think of is that bolts would be easier to replace if needed. Other than that, not sure if one is "better" than the other. I now have a car with each. The MX-5 uses studs and nuts. I'm tempted to get the factory MX-5 wheels center bores bored out to fit the MINI and just use aluminium centering rings for ease of install and peace of mind. I know that they do not carry any load once the lug nuts are all torqued down but having something there that more or less, "connects" everything, makes me feel better. The center bores to the Mazda's are 54.1 and the Mini's 56.1..... Makes me wonder if the MINI's wheel hubs would fit on the Mazda's and visa-versa. The brake rotors are only one mm off from each other as well with, I think, the Mazda's being one mm larger. They have the same 4x100 bolt pattern.
Oh, and over on Miata.net there are a dew threads about 949 Racing's 6UL's having a "bad batch" of 15x8 wheels that tend to crack and break in a catastrophic manner. Which is sad as they are 12.6 pounds each.
first mod on every car I buy for Autocross or track use is convert to studs, makes life so much easier!
the first generation of 6ul had cracking problems, afaik they resolved that many years ago but they are all no longer available. Glad I got mine before they stopped making them, 15x8 work well for me.
Makes one wonder if there is a reason the MINI 17” wheels weigh up around 27# each and wheels from Enkei in the same size come in at about 15#... Hmmmm
In the studs vs bolt discussion I have wondered if the alignment of the studs when they are installed plays into them breaking. That is, they don’t have much of a shoulder on them to make them perpendicular to the hub and wheel. If they are not perpendicular, then there will be a bending moment on it when the nut is torqued. This can lead to fatigue failure. On the flip side, I have also wondered if threading and unthreatening the bolts will wear out the threads in the hub.
As you say, no clear winner with respect to either.
you mean cross threaded? That would be pretty obvious they thread in just like a wheel bolt.
They do have a shoulder, but my wheel spacers have holes larger than the shoulder so they do not do anything, the wheel centers on all the lug nuts, not onto the bolts or hub
08-29-2020, 08:47 AM
Once you stepped onto the slippery slope the grade angle increased for your merry ride down and before you realize you are over the deep end into the abyss of no return.
Interesting are also the exchanges of use or not use wheel studs.
