Drivetrain 05 pepper white MCS modification project
#1977
Can - wtf?
It was our track team's telemetry engineer's fault. We had high hope in this past 3-day event that we would gather some useful data by putting the AiM Solo 2 DL to work for us. Only that we found out all too late that the data logger logged nothing from Desire's CAN bus. The dead giveaway is there was no RPM on the display pages. Well at least we got our lap times.
Why am I always think that if you want to get things done right, you have to be willing to roll up the sleeves and DIY.
There are many things that could go wrong while tapping into Mini's CAN bus seems pretty forward. However everything is suspect especially I elected to get the longest cable (2m long), and also extended the CAN signal tap from the tachometer down to the European parcel shelf. I broke out the 4 channel DSO.
In the following screenshot of the DSO, channel 1 (yellow) is CAN+ and channel 2 (magenta) is CAN-. Something obviously is very wrong in both the amplitude of CAN- as well as the signaling. There are clues in the scope screen shot, and snapping this photo leaves me time to ponder the possible causes. BTW, the tachometer in the Mini works, but the AiM Solo 2 DL acts like it simply is not able to get the data off the CAN bus.
You are welcome to chime in as to the possible cause. I now have a pretty good idea the possible cause but it would be a major PITA to investigate and rectify.
Why am I always think that if you want to get things done right, you have to be willing to roll up the sleeves and DIY.
There are many things that could go wrong while tapping into Mini's CAN bus seems pretty forward. However everything is suspect especially I elected to get the longest cable (2m long), and also extended the CAN signal tap from the tachometer down to the European parcel shelf. I broke out the 4 channel DSO.
In the following screenshot of the DSO, channel 1 (yellow) is CAN+ and channel 2 (magenta) is CAN-. Something obviously is very wrong in both the amplitude of CAN- as well as the signaling. There are clues in the scope screen shot, and snapping this photo leaves me time to ponder the possible causes. BTW, the tachometer in the Mini works, but the AiM Solo 2 DL acts like it simply is not able to get the data off the CAN bus.
You are welcome to chime in as to the possible cause. I now have a pretty good idea the possible cause but it would be a major PITA to investigate and rectify.
#1979
CAN bus differential signaling
DC offset, and polarity of the signaling of CAN+ and CAN- give away the likely cause.
this is how the CAN bus signals should be; image credit Interworld Electronics
this is how the CAN bus signals should be; image credit Interworld Electronics
#1980
fixed!
As a key step to systematic fault isolation I first compiled in my head a list of possible problems:
So the proof of the analysis is in the result of further debugging. I know I will need a DMM, a soldering iron, and tape to finishing the job.
I had a pretty good idea that the likely cause is a bad solder joint of the splice by the tachometer due to the tight confine
I suspected the CAN- splice onto the YEL/BRN is not making contact
hence this is the one that I undid the electrical tape
I conducted continuity test to verify that indeed the CAN- wire was just floating; time to break out the soldering iron
a bit of flux and heat and the bad solder joint is fixed
while the oil line was still not connected I switch on the ignition but not starting the engine to capture a trigger of the CAN bus signal; all good now and this is how they should look
I tidied up the splices with some fleece tape and all look factory
got RPM now
and matches the 1200 RPM read on the tach
I even tested the shift lights with a quick re-programming to lower the starting RPM so I didn't have to rev the engine while it is still a bit cold
It is all fixed! and Desire got a much needed head to toe wash. She is white trash filthy.
- operator error in operating the DSO
- BMW may utilize a proprietary CAN bus signaling levels
- my AiM Solo 2 DL is defective
- I strung out the cable too long and hence cause signal integrity problem; this would be a bit more difficult to determine
- there is a programmable 120 ohm termination resistor and may be it is broken due to software bug; this would require some trial and error to sort out
- for some reason the CAN bus in Desire is quasi-defective leading to the strange looking CAN- signal; may be due to a blown ESD diode or broken CAN transceiver but somehow the tachometer tolerates it but not the AiM Solo 2 DL
- the CAN - signal is somehow open and is just flopping in the wind; the signal that I was seeing on the DSO is simply coupled over from the CAN+ wire as the two are routed as twisted pair
So the proof of the analysis is in the result of further debugging. I know I will need a DMM, a soldering iron, and tape to finishing the job.
I had a pretty good idea that the likely cause is a bad solder joint of the splice by the tachometer due to the tight confine
I suspected the CAN- splice onto the YEL/BRN is not making contact
hence this is the one that I undid the electrical tape
I conducted continuity test to verify that indeed the CAN- wire was just floating; time to break out the soldering iron
a bit of flux and heat and the bad solder joint is fixed
while the oil line was still not connected I switch on the ignition but not starting the engine to capture a trigger of the CAN bus signal; all good now and this is how they should look
I tidied up the splices with some fleece tape and all look factory
got RPM now
and matches the 1200 RPM read on the tach
I even tested the shift lights with a quick re-programming to lower the starting RPM so I didn't have to rev the engine while it is still a bit cold
It is all fixed! and Desire got a much needed head to toe wash. She is white trash filthy.
Last edited by pnwR53S; 08-25-2019 at 02:41 PM.
#1981
potato chips
Desire eats brake rotors like I potato chips. More crunchy treats to be installed in time for next club days.
And she piled on 400 track miles last weekend. She also got a half *** oil change (san oil filter) just before the track days, and I need to log the change in the maintenance spreadsheet.
And she piled on 400 track miles last weekend. She also got a half *** oil change (san oil filter) just before the track days, and I need to log the change in the maintenance spreadsheet.
Last edited by pnwR53S; 08-29-2019 at 06:52 AM.
#1982
Desire's best ORP CW time
The proof is in the pudding and we've got pudding to show Desire's best lap times in this past club event. The best lab was 2:03.20. This was CW configuration at ORP. I am still struggling to figure out how to use the AiM analysis software.
Red Baron is all envious. Rest assured that he won't just lay down and die. He will fight to the bitter end. I just texted the bad pilot with the photo proof. He is trash talking.
Red Baron is all envious. Rest assured that he won't just lay down and die. He will fight to the bitter end. I just texted the bad pilot with the photo proof. He is trash talking.
Last edited by pnwR53S; 08-26-2019 at 04:46 AM.
#1983
autonomous track car
I have talked to many owners of paddle shift high end cars of what they do with the gearbox/transmission. In time I would realize often the cars are much faster when left in the automatic mode. I'd like to remark that I have no doubt that manual shift gearboxes are obsolete. Inevitably, the question is what is the ultimate inevitability? I'd liked to joke that - so when can I order an autonomous track car?
It seems that my joke of the inevitable has arrived sooner than I anticipated.
autonomous track car doing hillclimb @Goodwood
It seems that my joke of the inevitable has arrived sooner than I anticipated.
autonomous track car doing hillclimb @Goodwood
Last edited by pnwR53S; 08-27-2019 at 04:48 PM.
#1985
#1986
graveyard dead here
So dead here these days. Came to rescue for something interesting to read are the comments on this classic mini on BAT. I find BAT auction listings are more engaging than just about anything on Jalopnik these days.
image credit Bring A Trailer listing
image credit Bring A Trailer listing
#1988
OVERDRIVE
iTrader: (1)
So dead here these days. Came to rescue for something interesting to read are the comments on this classic mini on BAT. I find BAT auction listings are more engaging than just about anything on Jalopnik these days.
image credit Bring A Trailer listing
image credit Bring A Trailer listing
The comments to that listing are interesting. A lot like the comments posted on YouTube. There is always some expert that either over thinks things or doesn’t know anything.
I posted a picture on Albert’s thread of a green street Mini. The person who owns that one, owns something like 25 of them. He says, people just call him up to give him one that they no longer want. I doubt this one on BAT is worth the quote of $20k+, even if it was once owned by Jim Hall...
#1989
I scare to death with the experiences of catching the loose lug bolts in multiple incidents. I heard too many stories of horror of people loosing a wheel or worst or not worst steering or brakes. The subtle suspension knock has so far evaded diagnosis. I am hopeful this time I nailed it. It is one thing I checked from the get go but decided it was not a suspect. It is in this video:
I inspected it again a week ago and it definitely has gotten worst. I want to get this sorted before the next ORP club event so not to be punished by die Valkyries.
Thanks for the PIR race video. I should pay more attention to the local race events.
I inspected it again a week ago and it definitely has gotten worst. I want to get this sorted before the next ORP club event so not to be punished by die Valkyries.
Thanks for the PIR race video. I should pay more attention to the local race events.
Last edited by pnwR53S; 08-30-2019 at 03:49 PM.
#1990
Sorry I forgot to answer your oil change question. I not not one that that is **** retentive on very low mile oil change interval. I like to hit between >3k and <5k, depends on the service duties. Before the last track event I realized it was a bit past 3k but mostly track duty. Rather than fussing with the oil filter and risk damaging the drain back valve in haste, I decided a half *** job (no filter change) is better than none as the filter is designed to last much longer.
The following users liked this post:
Eddie07S (08-30-2019)
#1991
OVERDRIVE
iTrader: (1)
I had been changing mine oil before each event, in part because of how much the turbo cooks the oil. I find that some oils are better than others. 5-30 Castol and 0-40 Mobil 1 are POS and clearly break down quickly (a very scientific method of listening to how the engine sounds and how it looks on the dip stick. ). I have been using Motul 5-40 which seems to last much better. I ask as I am running this last oil change longer than I usually do and just curious as to what other people are doing with theirs. So far I have 4 track days on it and less than 1000 miles of driving on it.
#1992
OVERDRIVE
iTrader: (1)
I think there were 4 races at PIR (GT4 and TC). Here are links to each of the car classes and from there just click “video” in the top menu bar. I believe the TC link should have the Gen III MINIs in it (I haven’t watched it yet)
#1993
I had been changing mine oil before each event, in part because of how much the turbo cooks the oil. I find that some oils are better than others. 5-30 Castol and 0-40 Mobil 1 are POS and clearly break down quickly (a very scientific method of listening to how the engine sounds and how it looks on the dip stick. ). I have been using Motul 5-40 which seems to last much better. I ask as I am running this last oil change longer than I usually do and just curious as to what other people are doing with theirs. So far I have 4 track days on it and less than 1000 miles of driving on it.
I understand when it comes to engine oil, color is not to be the judge for the service life left. I sure can relate that the engine often would tell you the oil has deteriorated. Most likely because of the reduction of viscosity affecting the hydraulic valve lifters that are the canary birds.
#1994
OVERDRIVE
iTrader: (1)
I have never own any turbocharged cars. I can see why you want to change the oil more frequently given the ungodly high temperature the oil exposes to. Don't some of the oil advertised to be specially formulated for turbocharged engine of modern cars?
I understand when it comes to engine oil, color is not to be the judge for the service life left. I sure can relate that the engine often would tell you the oil has deteriorated. Most likely because of the reduction of viscosity affecting the hydraulic valve lifters that are the canary birds.
I understand when it comes to engine oil, color is not to be the judge for the service life left. I sure can relate that the engine often would tell you the oil has deteriorated. Most likely because of the reduction of viscosity affecting the hydraulic valve lifters that are the canary birds.
For me the canary birds sing (or stopped?) much sooner with some oils than others. Red Line and Motul are the 2 I have had the best success with based on that observation. And I have observed that when the noise increases the color of the oil on the dip stick is also darker. And you should have seen what the oil on the dip stick looked like when the auxiliary water pump, that feeds cooling water to the turbo bearings, on my car died and I was seeing oil temps of 285 degF (per the MINI ECU algorithm for oil temp as they are too cheap to put in a real oil temp sensor). I know none of these are perfect indicators of the condition of the oil, but I also got no good help from the oil tests I had done. They all said everything was great, except I had high iron in the oil... When the canary birds tell me it is time for the oil to go, it goes. Cheap insurance to keep the engine running, in my book.
#1995
Last edited by pnwR53S; 08-30-2019 at 01:27 PM.
#1997
i am the chosen one
I received this classy personalized mail from Mercedes Benz. I assumed it must be some marketing pitch for an invite to visit their showroom, may be for a E Class sedan.
I think the only Mercedes I am interested in are the Sprinter, and the AMG GT4. OK, I will take a G-Wagon too if they give me 80% discount.
It turns out it is a pitch for an "impressive investment opportunity". No. Not owning a stake in the company, but rather their First Class Demand Note at a whopping 3% APR.
I only have one thought. How much would I need to invest for one year to make enough money for a lightly optioned A-Class with this "impressive investment opportunity" that returns 3% APR. Don't forget inflation.
I think the only Mercedes I am interested in are the Sprinter, and the AMG GT4. OK, I will take a G-Wagon too if they give me 80% discount.
It turns out it is a pitch for an "impressive investment opportunity". No. Not owning a stake in the company, but rather their First Class Demand Note at a whopping 3% APR.
I only have one thought. How much would I need to invest for one year to make enough money for a lightly optioned A-Class with this "impressive investment opportunity" that returns 3% APR. Don't forget inflation.
#1999
Did a quick search on their most recent earnings report and saw they issued a profit earning just before the 2nd quarter report.
German industries are entering a downturn thanks to the trade wars and the rise of popularism on the whole planet. BTW, why is it called popularism when few benefit?
Back to working on Desire to pinch a few pennies. I like to earn the old fashion ways.
German industries are entering a downturn thanks to the trade wars and the rise of popularism on the whole planet. BTW, why is it called popularism when few benefit?
Back to working on Desire to pinch a few pennies. I like to earn the old fashion ways.