Starting with the 2020(?) model year they switched to a different engine variant, added a Particulate Filter (this is why you can't add the JCW Pro Exhaust anymore) and changed the ECU tuning.

So you're never going to get the pops and burbles the early F56's have.

 

Thanks for that Matthew - I guess I should have done better research before ordering (it's not like the dealer is going to A] know about things like this, and B] tell me even if they did). It's a great get-around car don't get me wrong, but it seems the JCW-ness of the trim level has been watered down to the point I might as well have just gotten an S, or just started a collection of 5 or 6 R53s for the same money.

I was willing to accept that the top-end 2021 JCW only has a tiny smattering of body painted extras (rocker panels) as opposed to all the black plastics on the fender trim, that I have to buy a $500 OEM piano black belt line trim when everything else is black (seems to be true for 2022 as well), that the wheel OEM JCW choices were horrible and over-priced, that the hood scoop wasn't functional and requires a $1500 Eventuri intake to take advantage of, that the available BRG green was way too bright to be considered a metallic BRG forcing me into a non-metallic Rebel Green, that I wouldn't be receiving a rebate for the DDC delete, that I couldn't get an actual JCW steering wheel with the Malt Brown interior, even though the shift/brake boots still have red stitching, and that the JCW BT exhaust was no longer available (due to the particulate filter/engine combo you mentioned above)..... but even with all those compromises I was still a fairly happy buyer. However, I soon discovered the ridiculous rev-hang and now, the latest realization that the charm of the over-run burbles isn't 'baked-in' to my JCW, I think those two things have sadly tipped me over into the buyer's remorse category.

I realize there's going to be a *chance* that somebody will come out with a tune to delete the rev-hang, and possibly even add over-run burbles... but at this moment, I'd have a real hard time recommending a 2021 JCW to anyone over an S, if they're just looking for a generalized MINI experience and don't need the extra HP or braking capabilities. In my (admittedly frustrated) opinion, there's just not enough 'John Cooper Works' in the JCW checkbox anymore. Maybe they're following suit with BMW in the dilution of the ///M brand. Penny for penny, maybe I should'a considered that GP3 a little harder after-all?

P.S. #2010 is still available at my dealer...hmmmmm it's been sitting in the Phoenix sun for 6 months, maybe they'd be willing to do a trade deal LOL

 

If a GP3 had back seats I’d be all over it! If my Mini was a third car, I would also be all over a GP3. But, since I still drop off jr. at school sometimes, it’s not meant to be...

I have been following your thread and I think your car is gorgeous with the green and tan combo, but I understand your concerns. It sounds like you would have really benefit with the more “extreme” gp3, albeit it would have been more from the handling side. The stock exhaust doesn’t seem to match the JCW pro on my 2017 JCW. For me, sound is so important I can’t drive the car without first opening the flap of my JCW pro exhaust. It’s just so intoxicating! I still say one of the best sounding cars on the road... Even though you can’t go JCW pro, the Remus will give you the exact same experience (minus the pops). If you were comfortable going the tune route, I’m sure they could add burbles for you?

Circling back, although you’d take a hit, it might be worth trying to work a deal for that GP3. It still won’t have pops, but man, those things seems really special. I would open up the exhaust slightly and call it a day!

 

Thanks for following, and your nice comments on my green/tan JCW!

We missed our opportunity to have kids (just little puppies now), and my JCW has its back seats folded down for packages more than they're up! On top of that, I hate trying stuff co-workers in the back seats for lunch outings (I've had lots of other coupes!) so not having a back seat is a huge plus in my situation!

I was definitely planning on getting the Remus (since there's not point in getting the factory JCW exhaust since the electronics won't work), but that was when I thought there were going to be over-run crackle... Just having a louder exhaust is only part of the fun, as you obviously agree-

Re. GP3: Message has just been sent to my dealer...we'll see what they say. They kinda owe me a solid for a few things related to my transaction with them, so it will be interesting to hear what my MA has to say about the 1st world 'predicament' I've put myself into LOL I'm guessing my loaded green and tan sunroof delete car will be a much easier sale than the GP3.

The only tech feature I think I might miss on the GP3 is the lack of adaptive cruise control...I've come to really appreciate that option (had it on my 2017 X4 as well as my current JCW). On the other side of the tech, I'm finding the park distance control option to be more of an annoyance than anything, and although I'm really getting used to the convenience of the HUD, it still doesn't have enough height in the electronic adjustment to be centered on the screen when I'm reclined low in my seat (have to stretch up to see it). Plus, how long until the HUD mechanism goes out of whack! The HK audio is really nice, but I usually only listen to YouTube videos and a touch of (crappy sounding) XM radio, so a top end audio system isn't a deal breaker for me, especially on a GP3...

Here's the car in question, and I see that it even has heated seats:

https://www.mininorthscottsdale.com/...2m2n18967.html

But I took pics of this car when I ordered my JCW, and it was still on the back lot when I picked it up 2 months later...I hate that they didn't protect these special edition cars from the sun here in AZ....so sad.

 

as a BMW life time grease monkey I must share this video showing one of the best F1 drivers using a BMW Coupe for the 2nd best fun in the world.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZ2...halm_MG38kE26A

 

Hi Everyone! Thought I would chime in as there’s a lot of miss information about the 2020/21 MC F56 JCW. So yes BMW/Mini added a GPF filter but fortunately it’s not included in our NA vehicles. With that said, you can do a JCW Pro Exhaust upgrade but you will need to order it for a B46 motor. I’m currently upgrading my ‘21 F56 JCW and installing a B46 JCW Pro Exhaust along with a Eventuri CF Intake System. As far as the ECU, Dinan is about to launch a reflash for our vehicles very soon and NM Engineering has a Power Module other than that there’s nothing out there to brag about. Charles I plan on following your lead and do the JCW Pro Suspension Upgrade as my does not have DCC and I fine that your experience with that setup is worth going after. I totally agree that Mini really watered down the JCW Brand big time! My 2015 F56 JCW is amazing and I absolutely love it, just wanted to get a manual transmission which I really wanted so that’s the only reason why I upgraded. It’s a shame the dealerships have no ambition on installing these exhausts on our cars even though it fits perfectly! My dealership showed me the bulletin that BMW/Mini should not be installing exhausts as it is not authorized as per EPA Guidelines which clearly is total BS! Anyway, if you don’t believe me feel free Google 2021 Mini F56 JCW Pro Exhaust Upgrade and you will see there’s a gentleman who installed it himself and explains the GPF story. Thanks everyone! BTW, the GP is an amazing car, almost bought it but it’s definitely not a DD car! I drive my JCW as a DD into NYC everyday and love the feel of the car all the way around where the GP is much more harsh and stiffer, definitely a track car. Enjoy, Jose

 

Thanks for your great advice and commentary Jose- I think you've brought me back from the edge (for now!). My dealer hasn't responded to my message as of yet, but I have to be honest: I *think* I'd still go for the GP if the deal wasn't too painful money-wise. I know it's not the best DD, but I still have plans to get another R53 down the road which I could DD, and I can't think of a better time (i.e. COVID) to get a collector type car where the miles will be kept very low for the foreseeable future. I've had my JCW for 94 days now and only put 1350 miles on it so far. I do very much enjoy my drives when I do go out, but I'm not one to just pile on miles for the sake of driving.

To continue, a large part of my issues with the F56 and especially JCW, is the limited wheel choice due to crazy high-offset and necessity to not only clear the big brakes but stay reasonably within the wheel wells, and then the stretched tires to boot. The GP has solved all of that for the most part (albeit in a very drastic cosmetic manner. But to be honest, I like the bonded CF side flares better than the standard MINI black plastic fender trims. I like the GP's 4 spoke wheels just fine too...and the tire choice (size) is awesome in my opinion; it just looks 'right' to me. BTW I wonder if my JCW coil overs would fit the already tweaked GP suspension??? Hmmmm. Can let's make the GP even more harsh? LOL BTW, why doesn't the GP come with these coil-overs from the factory???

That is some interesting news on the upcoming DINAN product release, as they don't currently offer anything for '20-'21 JCW Hardtop. Where's the best place (besides FB) to keep up on the DINAN timeline and offerings? Do you think they are going to be able to kill the B46D rev-hang and add back in some pops and burbles without any exhaust mods? Or does the newly added GPF screw up that plan? I'm OK with getting a Remus, or one of these OEM options, if I *have* to get a new exhaust system (https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-...t/11122359631/ or https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-...t/11122359631/), but I really want to know what DINAN has planned for the '20-'21 ECU's before committing to research an alternative exhaust solution.

It will suck to pay $1000+ for an exhaust and $1000 for DINAN tune, + labor, and who knows what else just to get back some modicum of a sporty sounding top-end JCW model. Then there's the $2000 mandatory tire and wheel upgrade after that so I can stopped being ridiculed as having an ugly Fiat 500 by my mates lol. So you can see my dilemma, I'm all about the looks and sounds first, and actual performance 2nd... I'm not afraid to admit it. I'm almost 50 now, and 231 HP in a car this small is plenty for me (although you do have to work for it!). I like taking my cars to Cars N Coffee and having a little something 'special' to spark conversation. Right now I don't think I'm getting my bang for the buck in that department. Certainly the GP3 has received some negative press on its polarizing looks too, but out of the box, I think it's a much more impressive package in that regard, 301HP not withstanding. Being a former M Coupe owner, I can deal with polarizing. Mundane is where I start having issues. I like the looks of my JCW overall, but I think I have another $5K to go on cosmetics and sound before we can get beyond the pedestrian vibe the car has now.

BTW, the first MINI I ever drove, was the 2020 MINI GP3. Although I couldn't hammer on it (it only had 18 miles on the ODO) and I was driving on very nice Scottsdale roads, I didn't really find it to be objectionably harsh. I wish it had a DCT at least, but I'm really coming around to the idea of the GP3. Can't be many new ones left out there to be had.

 

Charles Thank You for your truth and honesty! As a 50+ year old I believe exactly like you! I Absolutely Love The GP but it’s missing the Panoramic Roof and clearly I’m a little old for the wing on the back. I bought into Mini to get my craving of driving to and from NYC as a joyful racer instead of beating down my Porsches’ on the NJ/NYC highways which really are killing cars around here. Yes, night and day to the Porsche but I can honestly say these cars are amazing when done right and configured better than factory. I’m currently running a set of snow tires on my JCW and I’m sure people think I’m a crazy idiot for driving a Mini in the snow storms. That being said... trade your JCW and get yourself the GP, life is short and it’s worth you getting what you want! Enjoy my friend! Jose

 

How I forgot, Dinan is 4-6 weeks away from intro to the real world according to the rep. I’m sure it will be longer as COVID has probably screwed the timing up on this. Gives me time to break my JCW in before the tune. Enjoy, Jose

 

And if you want a back seat and a panoramic roof and don't love the huge spoiler get a car like mine: same motor, brakes, chassis, tranny as the GP with plenty of room, All4 (no nasty torque steer), adjustable exhaust sound, and a sunroof, all for the same price as a GP.

 

The people who purchased my '06 JCW also just got a 2021 JCW Clubman All4 in the same color combo as me.... We're going to get the two cars together for a photo shoot sometime soon. But yes, your car seems to be the 'practical' GP

 

Didn't you get yours AT Mini North Scottsdale (where I got my 07 MCS and 14 JCW Coupe)? You got an R56 with a manual tranny as I recall. My 07 had a manual. This 8 speed I can hardly feel it shift. The Coupe had a 6 speed which was quite different.

 

Nope, mine is a JCW 3 door hardtop (F56), not a Clubman.... And yes I did get it at the Scottsdale dealership (still waiting to hear back from them on the GP BTW!)

 

Yes I though it was a hatch JCW because it has a manual transmission. Can only get automatic in my model. I bought mine in Tempe they were the only one who had my car on the lot I never ordered my Minis.

 

Earlier posters chimed in on your POV for rev hang.

There be multiple tuner options for adding in the pops and bangs if patience isnt an option. From the land of particle filters:

https://www.minif56.com/threads/mg-f...1/#post-843255

 

FWIW I had the ECU of my 2014 JCW Coupe tuned at a shop in Tempe about 3-4 years after I bought it and not only did it accelerate better but when I'd let off the gas there was a lot of burbles and pops from the exhaust that wasn't there before. The guy who did it didn't tell me that would happen but it did. As I recall it was usually at higher RPMs when I'd let off the gas. It was an automatic transmission.

 

Thanks for that Curly, just took a look at the MG flasher website and the stuff they have available for the BMWs.... very cool how you use a combination of sport mode settings and button presses to select different levels of burble (for one example).

So it seems they're working on MINI tunes with that Polish guy, per that post you linked above? I'll keep an eye out for the completed product (as well as DINAN's). I assume that anything for the B48 should be applicable to my US (i.e. SULEV emissions) spec B46D, correct? I wish there was more clarity on model years and build dates etc. with these tuners, as it seems lately that we're often up against manufacturers blocking tuning via OBDII. I remember in the 2019-2020 time frame there was a cross-over point where BMW locked out tuning from the diagnostic port (although I think they later cracked it).

So it looks like the burbles are taken care of quite easily with these tunes, and highly adjustable too - that's awesome. Still haven't seen anything definitive for eliminating the MINI rev-hang though, hopefully that will come next.

As far as being patient goes, I think that is my only option now, as I finally got a reply from my MA (whom I really like BTW!) on my JCW for GP3 trade-in request. I fully admit, a new car purchase rarely makes any financial sense. However, trading in a 4 month old custom ordered car for a more exclusive version is absolute, unadulterated lunacy. My $43,000 USD JCW (with 1400 miles) is now worth only $32K on trade (I owe less than that, but not by much). So there's $11K in depreciation in just 4 tanks of gas. Then, there's no discounts on the GP3, even though it's been on the lot for nearly 7 months. Then, there's no interest rate incentives through MINI on the GPs (or e-MINIs). So instead of 1.9% financing, it's around 3-3.5% depending on term. Then, the car already has window tint and ceramic coating, another thousand bucks. Bottom line, if I were to go through with this, I'd essentially be paying over $58,000 for a GP3, as compared to about $47K, had I bought it instead of my JCW back in Sept. So for better or worse, I'm hanging on to my Rebel Green JCW! At least now I know I can start buying wheels, tires, exhaust, tuning mods, etc.with confidence now.

 

I think once you get exhaust on that car you will really start falling in love - especially when paired with the manual. I’m not sure if you decided on suspension, but I think you could even grow to love the cup spoke wheels as they can look amazing when lowered on coilovers with some spacers. Anyway, after looking at the numbers, I think you are definitely making the right choice! I look forward to following your journey.

 

To the writer who is unhappy with the JCW, the first thing I get from reading your post is that you should quickly go to a different dealership. You should also contact Mini directly with the issues, you may be surprised, they might be able to help out.
There are currently programs running on Mini for both low finance and dollars off on purchases through month of Feb. They had the same deal in December and part of Jan too. I think it gives you $1,500 off the purchase of the car you are looking at it. On my Clubman S it will give $1,000. off. Because it didn't apply to me, I can't recall the finance deal, but 1.6% is sticks in my head. Just to to Mini.usa. They always have whatever deals they are offering listed there. Don't expect your MA to find it for you. Even though Mini pays the dealership the money back and it does't effect their bottom line, I strongly suspect that the reason the MA didn't mention it to me, is that the dealership planned to get the rebate and keep it. I only mentioned it AFTER we had agreed on a price as i didn't want it filtering into what their best price was. When I did mention it after agreeing on price, I could almost feel the displeasure coursing down the phone line! It is kind of sneaky to offer you $1,500 off list and then not tell you that MINI will give you that regardless of your purchase price!
My dealer too said they didn't negotiate off list price, in my case because it was a custom order. I gave them my offer in writing and since it was all by phone, told them the truth, I was going to shop it out to other dealers even if it meant I had to drive a ways to pick it up or incur shipping charges! A few days of radio silence and they called and accepted my written offer. Only after the price was negotiated did I say and "of course I will get any promotion that is applicable at the time of delivery as that money doesn't come from you anyway.......
There is almost always a built in discount for repeat buyers so that part bugged me too. Check the Mini site, it lists all the discounts there (are ones for military, new grads, repeat buyers, etc.)
Cant stress strongly enough advice to move to a different dealership. You can still get factory service at any Mini dealership afterwards and go to the one most convenient for you. GOOD LUCK!
PS. I bet there are more than a few members here who would be interested in purchasing your new car. Can you list it on this site?

 

Perhaps my experience may make a difference: I bought a "Service Loaner" as my first Mini. Countryman S, FWD, 3000+ miles, Signature Trim, for 30,000.00. Six months later, I found a JCW Countryman in the back lot that hadn't been prepped for sale, only 1290 miles on it! The couple had it for two years, then traded it in on the big Lexus. They had the oil changed after one year (at 1000 miles) and simply didn't drive the car. Mini offered me 22,000 in trade for my S that now had 13,000 miles on it. Car Max offered me 25,000. Carvana offered me 27,164. So, give Carvana a shot...it was a 5000 difference! It LITERALLY took me 4 minutes from the time I closed the door in the parking lot to sign the papers to sell the S, and the money was in my account that day. Carvana probably already had my car sold before they bought it from me....why else would they pay so much more than anyone else? I paid 34,000 for the JCW with Iconic Trim, Original MSRP a few dollars under 50,000. They must have ripped that poor couple off that traded this car for the Lexus. I now have almost 10,000 miles on the JCW, nothing but smiles to report...put an NM Engineering exhaust on it, and I get burbles even in normal mode. LOVE IT!

 

Hi KC, thanks so much for taking the time to write out your thoughts- BTW, did I see you in the live chat on the MINIac livestream the other night?

I'm afraid going to a different dealer wouldn't be a solution in my case, as we're talking about the GP3 here, a car of which very few dealers have any left (it's the last one of 12 at my dealer), and they are simply just not interested in wheeling and dealing on a car like that. I don't think MINI corporate is going to listen to me either, and I'm pretty sure voicing my complaints about things that are all SULEV/emissions related (i.e. pops and burbles and rev-hang) are going to fall on deaf ears.

BTW, my dealer did get me the 1.9% financing and $1000 rebate on my 2021 JCW hardtop, and gave me a decent trade-in on my 2017 BMW X4 M40i (although they made $6K on it 2 days later!)... Scottsdale MINI is a premier dealer, and I don't think I'm going to find a better group of people in my area. I'm actually located in Tucson 100 miles away, and only went to Scottsdale because I wasn't feeling the passion at my local dealer (although I am still using them for oil warranty oil changes). Bottom line though, please realize we are talking a numbered, limited edition GP3 here, and the dealer is happy to have it in their showroom until the right buyer comes along at full price. They're not going to take my car back at anywhere near retail cost and just charge me the difference between my loaded JCW and the GP3.

And yes, I could offer it up for sale here, and then turn around and buy the GP3, but that probably wouldn't be much different than the trade-in option, since I would be losing out on the $32K reduction in tax burden that I'd get if I traded it in (in Arizona if you're buying a new car for $50,000 and trading in a car worth $30,000, you only pay taxes on the remaining $20,000). So I'd have to sell my JCW for something like $39,500 and I doubt I'm going to find a buyer at that price.

So in the end, today I just purchased a one owner, 65K mile 2006 MINI Cooper S with the dealer installed JCW package (210HP), and I will keep the 2021 JCW along side of it, restore the 2006 R53, and modify the 2021 F56 over time... Sounds like there are some good tuning options coming down the line to fix my issues with these new cars. Still love to have the GP3, but I'm super happy to have another 2006 R53 back in the stable!

 

Thanks for chiming in on your experience with Carvana - Honestly though, if I were to sell my 2021 MINI with only 1400 miles on it, I would try and sell it to this enthusiast group. There's no way Carvana, even being better than CarMax or the dealer trade-in, is going to give me anywhere near what I'd need to get out of the car. Additionally, my car was specially ordered with sunroof delete & DDC delete, and places like Carvana would consider that a negative, whereas the enthusiasts here would likely appreciate it. Remember I'm a recovering BMW collector that has bought, restored, and sold 26 BMWs of all types over the last 10 years, so I'm not a freshman at car valuation! There's just no way I would be able to sleep at night if I sold my car to any of those places at a huge loss, and then go and buy a new full-retail GP3 with basically no discount/incentives... I'd be the only guy in the USA who effectively spent $60K on a new GP3 MINI. The only way I was going to go through with it, is if I could have made the trade-up for around $3500-$4000 out of pocket...That ain't going to happen!

 

Yeah you know better than to get rid of a brand new Mini right away. I still am not sure what it is you don't like about it though. True, the GP3 (and my car) are entirely different platforms than your car (they are BMW M235i cars with Mini bodies, mine weighs more and has All4, longer wheelbase, 4 doors, and a back seat). FYI I did get about 11% off MSRP but not a good trade-in price at Tempe Mini last April.

 

Naah.
It can be tuff to follow along with the expanding 3rd gens - but the GP3 is based on what mini call the F56 platform. Same chassis for 3 door models ranging thro the mini one, diesel, S and JCW. And the GP3
This might help you get up to speed: Mini hatch F designations WIKIPEDIA. From what i gather the OP is comparing two 3 door F56s - albeit with different engines.

Not sure what your car is but mention of the All4, longer wheelbase and read seats im guessing a clubman? If so - this isnt an F56 This is a different chassis altogether. Mini call it the F54 platform and this has been around in its current form since 2015. Think more family utility than the f56 that includes the GP3. The forum for f54s be over here: 3rd Gen MINI F model sub categories

 

Yeah it's a different chassis like I said, but the engine, tranny, brakes, and some of the suspension are the same as the GP3. Based on the BMW M235i basically. (my cars are in my signature FYI).