I just learned to drive a manual transmission a couple of years ago, but I've developed this habit that I'm not sure what to think of. It seems that whenever I shift from one gear to the next, no matter what gear I'm in, I momentarily completely take my foot off the gas pedal. It's only right after I've shifted that I then press down on the throttle. Is this bad for the car or is it okay? Would this dramatically hinder acceleration?

I think I do this because when I was practicing on my mom's Miata, the RPMs would shoot up when I kept my foot on the gas pedal while shifting and it sounded like I was revving the engine too much. I tried to keep my right foot as neutral as possible, but it seemed like this still happened. Just looking for a smoother takeoff. Appreciate any advice. Thanks.

 

It doesn't sound like you are doing anything wrong. Maybe could be done better or smoother.

I think of driving a manual as using the clutch, shifting gears, using the trottle and brake all in fine balance.
There are things you can work on. Find a flat area or slightly downhill. Stop the car. Practice shifting into first gear and as you slowly ease off the clutch press on the gas very gently as you monitor the rpms on the tachometer. Keep the rpms to about 1200 to 1400 and try to let your foot off the clutch so smoothly that you don't feel and shift. Same with shifting from 1st to 2nd.

Takes some practice but as you get better and better you can shift from a start with less than 1000 rpm smoothly. Doesn't work going uphill.

Try looking up Turnfast.com and review their info on shifting.

 

As far as I know, easing off the gas while shifting gears is the right way to do it, if you didn't your revs would shoot up every time...

Am I wrong too?

 

>>As far as I know, easing off the gas while shifting gears is the right way to do it, if you didn't your revs would shoot up every time...
>>
>>Am I wrong too?
Here's what I learned in driving school. If you are on a road and there are no other cars or people. You can shift and get into whatever gear you want in any way you want. You are probably OK as long as you don't stall from having too little throttle or from letting off the clutch too fast.

But if you are trying to get somewhere quickly and smoothly on the track or otherwise or doing performance driving or even emergency maneuvers then you want to find a bit of balance between using the gas or throttle and using the brake or clutch to engage a gear or to control the speed of the car. For now let us leave the brake out of the mix.
So you have the car at a stop and you shift into first, you let off the clutch and the engine needs at least 1000 rpm or it will be a little easy to have trouble. If you don't have your foot on the gas then you cannot control how much more rpm you would like to have as you shift. So as I ease off the clutch I have my other foot either on the gas or the brake or both. Foot on the gas to increase rpm as needed to "Balance" the car's forward motion as I ease slowly off the clutch.
I suppose I can do the same with no foot on the gas but then I hope I would have enough rpms to engage the gear. Maybe, maybe not.

I found this tutorial- not bad
http://www.10w40.com/individual/100186.asp
some of it:
With the engine warmed up a bit, and a clear path ahead of you, push the clutch back in and move the gearshift to first. WIth your right foot still on the brake pedal, let the clutch out slowly. You will hear the engine slow a bit and the car try to move as you let it out. You have found the point at which the clutch "catches." Push the clutch back in and take your foot off the brake, and try it again. Car still doesn't move, huh? Push the clutch back in and release the parking brake. NOW you're set.

Clutch to the floor, right foot on the gas, give the engine just a little extra gas - not much. Now slowly let the clutch come up. As you feel that catch point, the RPMs will start to drop and the car will start to move forward a bit. Slowly give it more gas to keep the RPM's constant as you let the clutch out. This is the key to the whole thing. Give it enough gas to keep the RPM's constant until the pedal is all the way out. Now push in the clutch and brake to a stop. Repeat three or four times until that "catch" point starts to feel comfortable. Never rev the engine while letting out the clutch - remember the sandpaper and the disk behind this all? It you rev the engine while letting out the clutch, you wear off the surfaces of both disks. Likewise, it you don't give it enough gas to keep the RPM's up, it will stall. Practice until it takes no more than 1.5 to 2 seconds to smoothly take the car from dead stop to clutch all the way out. The faster you can smoothly get the car going, the less wear on the clutch.

Quit stalling!

In fact, since we just mentioned stalling, let's give it a try. Warn your passenger first. Try letting the clutch out WITHOUT giving it more gas. The car starts to move, then the engine dies, and the car jerks to a start. See how effective leaving the car in first with the engine off is? It just stops moving - hard. This is why you always leave the car in first gear when you park (and use the parking brake for safety's sake).

Have fun.

 

minihune: wow that's really informative. Thanks for the thorough tutorial!
I think what Fiver's mostly wondering about, though, is shifting at higher speeds, not from a standstill. From what I understand, he already knows how to drive stick pretty well but he's wondering if it's correct to release the gas pedal while depressing the clutch and shifting, say, from 2nd to 3rd, to prevent the revs from shooting up or possibly redlining.
As far as I know, this is the correct way to do it, though I might be wrong.
I can't imagine keeping the gas pedal floored while pressing the clutch and shifting, unless you did it really, REALLY fast...

 

>>minihune: wow that's really informative. Thanks for the thorough tutorial!
>> I think what Fiver's mostly wondering about, though, is shifting at higher speeds, not from a standstill. From what I understand, he already knows how to drive stick pretty well but he's wondering if it's correct to release the gas pedal while depressing the clutch and shifting, say, from 2nd to 3rd, to prevent the revs from shooting up or possibly redlining.
>>As far as I know, this is the correct way to do it, though I might be wrong.
>>I can't imagine keeping the gas pedal floored while pressing the clutch and shifting, unless you did it really, REALLY fast...

OK there are two different scenarios-
Shifting from 2nd to 3rd. You are going along and hit 3000 rpm in 2nd or going about 30 mph and you are ready to shift into 3rd. Unless you need to slow or be ready to slow for safety reasons you do not need to brake or you will loose speed and not need to shift. Therefore either your right foot is about to take a vacation or it is ready to go and on the gas- not punching it or leaning hard on it but ready to go while you monitor the rpms on your tach. You only need 3000 rpm to shift smoothly. Lets say as you shift you coast a bit and the rpms drop to 2800 or less then you can push on the gas pedal a bit to bring it back up and then do the shift. Point is that you should be "ready" with your right foot to add more throttle based on the reading of the tach. If you are already going way over 30 mph and the tach is reading 4000 rpm then you don't need more gas but you don't need to brake either unless it is for control of the car or safety reasons.
Downshifting from 3rd to 2nd
Here you are doing the opposite. You are going at 40+ mph in 3rd gear and turning or coming to a slower zone where you are going to be driving at less than 30 mph. As you coast and loose speed or as you brake your right foot is not actively on the gas pedal. You watch the tach and as it falls you can shift which revs up the engine a bit maybe 800 to 1000 rpm depending on the circumstance. If this is the case then yes you may want to lift your right foot off the gas.

Now just when you thought this driving a stick was a piece of cake there is something more to do with your right foot as you downshift. You can learn to "Heel and toe downshift".
see http://apps.edmunds.com/ownership/ho...2/article.html
Here is a bit of it:
A heel-and-toe downshift refers to a specific technique used to downshift a manual transmission car. It might seem bizarre to the general populace, but racecar drivers use it all the time. Once mastered, the heel-and-toe downshift offers the benefits of reduced vehicle wear-and-tear, better driver control and faster lap times on a racetrack.

The heel-and-toe downshift is a rather complex action involving both of the driver's feet, the driver's right hand, all three vehicle pedals and the gear shift lever. The purpose of the heel-and-toe is to smoothly match engine speed to wheel speed. Here is a generalization of how a normal person downshifts a manual transmission car.

Let's say Frank is driving his '01 Volkswagen Passat around town. He is approaching a right-hand corner while in fourth gear at 50 mph. He is going too fast to make it around the corner safely, so he starts braking until he drops the Passat's speed to about 25 mph. Frank sees on the tachometer that his engine revs are dropping too low, so he pushes in the clutch as he goes around the corner. As Frank thinks about accelerating, he realizes that the Passat is still in fourth gear, which isn't suitable for strong acceleration at such slow speeds. So he moves the shifter from fourth to second gear, lets out the clutch and motors away.

------
And-
You generally don't want to ever floor the gas pedal. Always think smooth and gentle. I guess if there was something about to crash into you directly from the rear and you could not turn then maybe you could floor it but that isn't always the best.

Again, from driving school, You always want all four wheels to have maximum traction with the ground at all times no matter what. If you floor it what happens? You have a slight thrust forward which puts greater load on the rear tires and less load on the front tires. This means you LOOSE traction to each of the front tires when you need it the most. What then should you do? Smoothly accelerate by easing onto the throttle and maintain maximum contact. No lurching, no sounds of the tires, no nothing but straight ahead movement. It can be done quickly- always think smooth.

I recommend the driving school to any MINI driver- you can learn alot, the instructors are first rate. You can learn how to control your car and maintain safety at all times. There is alot to learn and much to practice.
Be safe.

 

Anyone else have other good resources on shifting?

 

turnfast.com has a few....a few good diagrams showing the different steps of heal-and-toeing.

 

The best site I've found to date (and I've been looking hard)

http://www.happytogether.com/318ti/notebook/shifting/

They basically instruct you through the heel toe. Obviously, when you read some of the articles referenced above, and try it out for that matter, it seems impossible. I was having a bit of trouble myself when combining the braking, turning, double clutching, etc. Its too much to master all at once.

They give you some good beginner exercises, like just driving at 50mph in 5th and double cluching it to make a smooth shift into 4th. After practing this, and feeling like you got the hang of it (this exercise alone really helps with downshifting, especially once you get so fast at it that it otherwise seems normal), then you add in braking, cornering, etc.

Hope it helps,
Erik

 

Thanks for the link,

My instructors didn't think that double clutching was needed for the track, heel toe is good and will help- can be used for everyday shifting and driving and on the track. Requires skill.

Take it to the next level. Learn Heel to toe!

 

Thanks for the advice and all the links. I should probably be paying more attention to the tach. I usually find myself shifting based on how things sound. Toe-heel and double clutching sounds interesting, although I should probably improve my basic manual driving skills first LOL. Those are definitely on my checklist of things to learn though.

 

>>Thanks for the advice and all the links. I should probably be paying more attention to the tach. I usually find myself shifting based on how things sound. Toe-heel and double clutching sounds interesting, although I should probably improve my basic manual driving skills first LOL. Those are definitely on my checklist of things to learn though.
I find that if I shift by the sound of the engine it is OK but the shift points generally happen at lower than optimal rpms more like 2200 to 2500 instead of 3000. The faster you drive the more you will be past 3000 rpm by the time you shift. Generally if you want more torque and power then you would want to drive the MINI in lower gears with rpms very high up to 6000 rpm. This makes more noise but also you shift less and take advantage of the power.
The torque curve tends to be highest in the 3000 to 6000 range for the MCS.