Hi, I posted this over a week ago at 8thcivic.com and had a spirited discussion, including from some MINI fans. I still haven't made up my mind on the car selection yet, so I thought it's only fair to post it here, too....


Went to Carmax today to do some test driving, and got to drive a 2007 SI immediately after a 2006 MINI Cooper S, both relatively low mileage. Here are my impressions, in no particular order:

Size: Duh, Honda wins. Big trunk! Good back seat room.

Stereo: Honda wins. The MINI's stereo was adequate. The Civic's was pretty good.

Acceleration: Different. The Civic obviously likes some revs. I didn't VTEC it, but there's still some pull in the lower revs. The charged S has nice grunt from lower RPMS, but, conversely, doesn't spin up as fast.

Tranny: None in sight, but our sales person looked like he might experiment with gender roles from time to time. But, hey, let's not judge.

Transmission: Honda was notchier, . The MINI feels German in nature - mechanical and solid. The Honda feels Japanese - very snicky and precise. Both were fun to row.

Handling: The MINI feels like a go kart on the straights. It's a little twitchy and I can imagine darting around in a single lane at speed on a highway. The Civic's more buttoned-down and forgiving for normal driving. I had one chance to take a turn at speed, and there's where I got a surpise - the little go kart MINI squealed like a demon all the way around, and got tossed a little sideways on a bump at the midpoint. The Civic ate the turn up. One slight squeal at a steering adjustment, and it handled the bump very solidly.

Fit, finish and materials: Civic wins, hands down. The MINI felt more plasticky; the door slam was Subaru metallic, and the controls were comparatively flimsy. I was surprised, since the MINI tends to cost more than a similar Civic.

Seats: MINI seats were nice. Si were racier. Much stronger bolsters and fabric that feels like it'll take your jacket off as you get out of the car.

Summary: I really wanted to like that MINI. I love the styling and the quirky funkiness of the dash and controls. That short wheelbase and burbling exhaust promise hours of thrilling driving. But so many of the things I think are important are better done in the Civic. It wasn't really competitive.

Civic SI wins.

 

Congrats on finding the car that best fits your needs.

 

I too have done this recently, the big difference I found was that the MINI I drove didn't have a LSD and all of the Civic Si's come with one standard, made hard acceleration in turns a winner in the Si.

I don't look at the cars now but look at them after I get them and spend a few bucks on them.

Spending under $1k no some springs, rear sway bar, and a pulley upgrade will eliminate any performance gap between the 2 and the MINI should out perform in all categories based on my experience behind the wheel, regardless of the LSD issue.

Driving the used Si sedan hard was very gratifying but I'm not going to be zinging between 6-8.5k at every shift all day long, I think the low end torque and low rev acceleration will make the MINI more fun on the day to day.

And after all there is the looks department which is purely subjective but the Civic will blend in, especially if you get the sedan, whereas the MINI solicits stares and comments everywhere.

The interior of the Si is nicer in materials and fit/finish but that alcantra material is already starting to cause problems for si owners with 06-07 models and I just can't see it holding up well for too terribly long.

 

Sounds like you've come to an easy decision. Have fun with the Honda.

 

honestly, I'd test drive the new mcs.

I test drove the si back to back with the mcs and had much more fun in the mini.

The new mini is a bit more "refined" then the older one, imo. It's more of a daily driving car then the R53. I liked the fit and finish better, plus the twin scroll turbo gives nice low end torque. The changing steering ratios gives the car less twitchyness on a highway, while allowing you to still have the gocart ride in the turns..

I've ventured too far from the r56 club, time to head home.

 

Nice write up.

Mini is not for everyone.. but for those lucky enough to really drive one..you will understand what i mean.

 

I sorta feel the same way (having owned both now) about the MKV GTI and the my MCS. The GTI shrugged off uneven roads and the occasional potholes. Far better highway cruiser. I really think under 60 in the tight corners, the MINI is better, but anything over 60 the GTI was far better planted and secure. Especially high-speed sweepers. The GTI's interior trim was far greater then the MINIs and the car felt like a German tank (read: safe).

I really like the lines of the MINI though. Every angle is nearly perfect. And the seating position is unique and more to my liking. The lighter curb weight allows far more fun yanking it around curvy back roads when compared to the GTI.

 

My thoughts exactly. Buy the car that best suits your needs and style

 

kenchan likes honda's as well, but you dont see a CivicSI in his
garage, instead a 03 MCS. i wonder why that is....

 

Congrats on finding your car hope you have hours of happy driving.

 

I have had both and I liked the Cooper S better. The MINI has a great community and they have some many great events you can attend. Plus it is easy to individualize as well.

I love Hondas and it is fun to rev to the stratosphere, but to me it got old for a daily driver. I wanted more low end grunt. That being said they are both wonderful cars and you really can't go wrong with either one.

 

Thanks, but if it were easy, I wouldn't be here posting.

Things I don't like about the Civic:

- High revs. Not sure I want to spend my day in 5800+ rpm range. I drive a Lexus IS250AWD now, and I'm accustomed to decent acceleration with lower revs.

- Exhaust/engine note. The Civic is OK, but sounds harsh at high revs, and lacks the satisfying burble from the rear. And if there's anything I like, it's a satisfying burble from the rear.

- Styling. I think it's the best looking Civic ever, which is like saying that Rue McClanahan was the best looking Golden Girl. I love the look of the MINI. It's got personality.

- Gas mileage. 29 Civic, 34 MCS, (EPA hwy.) I do 110 miles round trip daily, nearly all hwy, and usually cruise at 80MPH. I think I'd get better mileage with the MCS (and certainly with an MC, which isn't off the table yet, either.) And, even if I don't, I can still be all self-righteous douchebaggy about owning a smaller car, instead of an overtly "sport injected" model.

I do, however, like the cost of the Civic in comparison, and the lack of a waiting time.

 

Strap on the obligatory ricer fart can on the civic and you will be good to go.

 

+1 on the suggestion for driving an 07. The 07 MINI is a very differently behaving beast, the tranny is much smoother to shift, and the turbo grunt is there with no noticeable lag, from low all the way near the redline (it does fall off a bit at the top end).

As for handling, I would definitely suspect alignment and/or possibly defective tires. My wife's car behaved exactly like you described straight from the factory. One alignment later (it was way off) and no darting, no jumping sideways in corners. Someone on here also described similar behavior, and turned out one of his tires was defective.

As far as the stereo, the Harman Kardon audio option is much superior to the standard stereo. You can find quite a few used MCS's with that option.

Seats, same thing. The standard MINI seats are ok, the "sport" seats much better imo.

I do have to say, I liked the Si I test drove last year. I think it was an 07, not sure. It does indeed have better fit and finish. But to me, two things kept me from buying it. One, it seemed huge to me (as big as a 90's accord) and second, it doesn't come in my favorite flavor: convertible. But if those two things weren't an issue, I'd have bought it on the spot. Very nice cars for the money.

 

Im having the same VERY hard time between the Mazdaspeed3 and the MCS convert...

 

Wow. I have never experienced this in my MCS and I've pushed my car way beyond my comfort level. Sounds like you drove a car equipped with half flat run flats.

Dean.

 

Ah .. so "Civic Si wins" doesn't quite reflect your feelings on the matter, eh?

 

i agree about the squealing issue around the corner. Did you check the tires of both cars? I dont currently own a mini, but ive thrown a couple around quite a bit and I never have gotten a single squeal or chirp. Maybe old tires?

 

as a former honda sales associate, id still choose the mcs, i obvoisly had the chance to play in the SI slightly less then someone who owns one, and daily driving they are definatly better. they have a smoother ride. handleing mcs hands down. my self with no lsd, out turn my friend in his new mugen civic si($34K) all day long. but i do like both cars, and if i didnt get the mcs , i would buy a sedan SI

 

Until you posted this, I was wondering why you even joined this forum since it seemed you had already made up your mind. Now I see that your decision hasn't been made yet.

If all you need is a dependable daily driver, get the Civic. If you perhaps are a car aficionado and want something with class, soul, and a huge following with great diversity, get the MINI. Good luck on choosing your car.

 

to each his own is what i say. find what you like. my recommendation is especially you are coming from a v6 car that has torque, you WILL miss it. Up until my MINI i was driving v6 cars with more torque than hp.

whenever i drove the honda, i always felt dissatisfied with the lack of torque. I've driven the Si, and it's the same. I don't wanna wring out the motor everytime i want to have fun.

fun can be had without downshifting in the mini. well at least in mine. also for a very minimal amount of money you can do a pulley and a tune on the mini for substantial increase in power.

I also like the uniqueness of the mini vs the civic. to me, it feels like you don't get the head turning appeal you do that you would get in a MINI. I've had people slow down next to me on the highway asking about my MINI.

twitchiness i will have to blame the run flats due to their stiffer sidewalls. I think the civics use either continental or bfgoodrich potenzas. either way, you can get a much better tire for the mini. Tires make a HUGE difference, especially on the mini. Especially if you go with non run flats.

my $.02
Have fun shopping on ur next car.

 

If it is any consolation to all involved. The 2006 and 2007 SCCA class SSC (showroom stock C) national championship's were won by Pete Taylor in a supercharged MCS. He not only beat the Si, he also beat the Mazda 3, which won in 2005. These are stock suspension, R compound tires, open brake pad, stock brake system street cars with any exhaust you want from the cat back. They have to leave the passenger seat and all the interior finish in the car as well. Add a roll cage, race seat with 6 point seat belt, Halon fire supression system, put on a drivers suit, helmet and gloves and go racing. The best drivers from around the country qualified for the right to compete in this race. The Mini won. They moved the car up a class this year and it is racing against the new Si, Solstice, BMW Z4 and MX-5. The runoffs aren't until October, but I had the oppurtunity to watch Robbie Davis pilot his '05 MCS (not the JCW-the SCCA won't let it into the class yet) at VIR in May. He didn't have the straight line speed of the Si, but he devoured him under braking and in the corners. While he did not beat the Si, finishing an impressive 2nd, he did set the track record by over a second.
The Mini is the better handling and braking car, you just have to know how to drive it. BMW brake systems are far superior to Japanese, again, you just need to know the limits. It sounds like you already sold yourself on the the Si anyway. Enjoy.

 

Don't think the OP is looking for a track car...

 

A quick comparison shows MINI is cheaper, better gas mileage, longer warranty, mulit-link rear suspension, leatherette standard, rain detection wipers, 250lbs lighter, 12 months and 14,000 mile longer bumper to bumper warranty....and.. a coolness factor like non-other.

Don't forget high resale of the MINI and high theft of civics. They are the #1 stolen car in 2006. Couldn't find the 2007 data right away.

 

Couldn't agree more. My last car was a last generation Honda Prelude. It was fun to drive and handled great. After a couple years I stopped driving it hard and it lost most of its enjoyment. Depending on where/how you're driving; driving in the city all of the time you just don't often make it to those higher revs. Without those higher revs the car simply isn't as exciting. This is exactly why I didn't go with a Honda/Acura for this car.

Also the uniqueness makes this car so much fun. The only looks you'll get in a Honda is from a bunch of high school kids and wannabe ricers who think that they live in the Fast and Furious. It gets old after awhile.

Both are great cars, it just depends on what you're looking for.