R50/R53 :: Hatch Talk (2002-2006) Cooper (R50) and Cooper S (R53) hatchback discussion.

R50/53 Torque Wrench help

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  #1  
Old 06-24-2008 | 05:27 PM
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Torque Wrench help

Okay, I know this is a bone head question, but, I bought a new wrench and it seems like all I need to do is unlock, screw up or down to a 'base' number, (once the vertical line is set to zero) then using the 1-4 around the edge, screw up or down to line these up to the zero to dial in.

Does this sound correct? That's the way the manual looks to me. I did use it to change my oil and when I torqued down the filter, it seems accurate as it 'clicked' just over, what I would say, was hand tight. I don't have any other experience with torque wrenches, so thought I'd make sure as I'll be replacing the plugs this weekend.
THANKS!
 
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Old 06-24-2008 | 05:28 PM
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brand? they're all different
 
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Old 06-24-2008 | 05:31 PM
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I meant to state in the OP.. it's: Neiko Pro.

Thanks!
 
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Old 06-24-2008 | 05:35 PM
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hmmm...mine's a Craftsman Digitork. I pull the cap out, twist to the setting and then let it back. Once it reaches torque, it 'clicks'.
 
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Old 06-24-2008 | 05:36 PM
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Here's some additional info:
[FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]3/8" Drive Neiko Pro Clicker type Torque wrench[/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]Adjustable from 15-80 ft / pounds in one inch pound increments [/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]M[/SIZE][/FONT][FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]easurement: foot pounds, kilogram meters, or Newton meters.[/SIZE][/FONT]
 
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Old 06-24-2008 | 06:01 PM
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Craftsman Digitork

Originally Posted by PGT
hmmm...mine's a Craftsman Digitork. I pull the cap out, twist to the setting and then let it back. Once it reaches torque, it 'clicks'.
Hey PGT:
Do you have the 5-80lb model and do you like it. I have an RMW head/cam/header/injector/install coming up very soon and wanted to get a decent torque wrench. Are you pretty happy wih that tool?

Thanks........
 
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Old 06-24-2008 | 06:05 PM
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I have two...the 5-80ft/lb 3/8" and the 25-250ft/lb 1/2". They work great, but the ratcheting pawl in the little one broke on mine after a year or two or regular shadetree use. it still torques fine and I won't replace it until it's kaput for good.
 
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Old 06-24-2008 | 07:08 PM
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Craftsmen tools carry a lifetime warranty, take it to your local store and get it replaced for free, on the spot.

Ok, the 5-80 model should be good for my needs here, I can use my older needle deflection model for the big stuff.

Thanks
 
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Old 06-24-2008 | 07:09 PM
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Handtools only
 
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Old 06-24-2008 | 07:14 PM
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Do any of these wrenches have a recalibration requirement? In the Army, we were always on top of calibration for these things. Were we over-doing it in the serviceor are we civilians being foolish to feel good because it 'clicks'?
 
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Old 06-24-2008 | 07:19 PM
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well, these torque wrenches aren't super-accurate mil-spec type. if you had one of those, they'd cost 3-5x as much and since accuracy means life/death, yes, good idea to get it calibrate. most engine builders use that type. for us home mechanics, +/-5% is ok. 72ft/lbs = range of 69-75 actual
 
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Old 06-24-2008 | 09:45 PM
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hey miniracer
like PGT points out craftsman lifetime warranty is only for hadtools.
they except their torque wrench from that.
bought a home depot 20-100 clicker,
ok so far
boxcars
 
  #13  
Old 06-25-2008 | 07:46 PM
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Originally Posted by PGT
well, these torque wrenches aren't super-accurate mil-spec type. if you had one of those, they'd cost 3-5x as much and since accuracy means life/death, yes, good idea to get it calibrate. most engine builders use that type. for us home mechanics, +/-5% is ok. 72ft/lbs = range of 69-75 actual
Makes sense. I was in aviation and I know the mechs were very careful--they had to fly with us.
 
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Old 06-25-2008 | 10:17 PM
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From: Washington. No, the other one.
Well, no one answered beemer2002's question, so here ya go:
Yeah, it looks like you're doing it right. If you want to check, there is a fairly simple method that also gives you an idea of the wrench's accuracy. Clamp the drive end (the part you snap the socket on) in a bench vise with the handle pointing straight up. Set the wrench for a value in the middle of it's range -around 40ft/lbs (it's most accurate in the middle range) and then using a *good* bathroom scale, place the scale against the end of the handle and pull it toward yourself. Watch the scale and listen for the 'click'. They both should coincide around 40. If nothing else, it will give you the confidence that you are setting it correctly. Pull smoothly and slowly -no jerking.
 
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Old 06-25-2008 | 11:05 PM
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Just make sure that the line for the "base" number is fully covered by the handle. If there's a gap between the line and the handle you are setting it too low. Keep turning and when zero comes back around you are at that base number. I hope this makes sense.
 
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Old 06-25-2008 | 11:43 PM
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seriously its a tq wrench how hard is it? its like asking how to drive stick. easly learned providing you can still do addition.
 
  #17  
Old 06-26-2008 | 04:04 AM
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Thanks Ancient Mariner!

Originally Posted by Ancient Mariner
Well, no one answered beemer2002's question, so here ya go:
Yeah, it looks like you're doing it right. If you want to check, there is a fairly simple method that also gives you an idea of the wrench's accuracy. Clamp the drive end (the part you snap the socket on) in a bench vise with the handle pointing straight up. Set the wrench for a value in the middle of it's range -around 40ft/lbs (it's most accurate in the middle range) and then using a *good* bathroom scale, place the scale against the end of the handle and pull it toward yourself. Watch the scale and listen for the 'click'. They both should coincide around 40. If nothing else, it will give you the confidence that you are setting it correctly. Pull smoothly and slowly -no jerking.
I have to say, you are the most thought provoking 'tinkerer' I've come across. Who would have thought of that method..you always have creative ways around things and I appreciate your sharing VERY much! Other MINI owners are lucky to have you on this forum. You should write your own manual! THANKS!!
 
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Old 06-26-2008 | 04:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Ancient Mariner
Well, no one answered beemer2002's question, so here ya go:
Yeah, it looks like you're doing it right. If you want to check, there is a fairly simple method that also gives you an idea of the wrench's accuracy. Clamp the drive end (the part you snap the socket on) in a bench vise with the handle pointing straight up. Set the wrench for a value in the middle of it's range -around 40ft/lbs (it's most accurate in the middle range) and then using a *good* bathroom scale, place the scale against the end of the handle and pull it toward yourself. Watch the scale and listen for the 'click'. They both should coincide around 40. If nothing else, it will give you the confidence that you are setting it correctly. Pull smoothly and slowly -no jerking.
.... assuming you have a torque wrench where the handle is about 12" long... usually a valid assumption... but some are longer... so they would read lower than the torque setting.... yes?
 
  #19  
Old 06-26-2008 | 10:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Ancient Mariner
Well, no one answered beemer2002's question, so here ya go:
Yeah, it looks like you're doing it right. If you want to check, there is a fairly simple method that also gives you an idea of the wrench's accuracy. Clamp the drive end (the part you snap the socket on) in a bench vise with the handle pointing straight up. Set the wrench for a value in the middle of it's range -around 40ft/lbs (it's most accurate in the middle range) and then using a *good* bathroom scale, place the scale against the end of the handle and pull it toward yourself. Watch the scale and listen for the 'click'. They both should coincide around 40. If nothing else, it will give you the confidence that you are setting it correctly. Pull smoothly and slowly -no jerking.
Or you could use a pull gauge or large fish weigh scale.
 
  #20  
Old 06-26-2008 | 10:13 AM
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Zero Torque Wrench after Use

Be certain to zero the torque wrench after use (set to it's lowest setting), this relieves the tension on the internal spring and keeps the accuracy much longer. Keeping it set at your last use's setting (for example 40 ft/lbs) it will over time affect spring tension and thus the torque wrench variance. You may find later your +/- 4% becoming +/-7% or more over time.
 
  #21  
Old 06-26-2008 | 06:10 PM
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Ancient Mariner,
Thanks for an elegant solution to checking calibration. With respect to Blimey's faux question, does he have a point? A lever allows one to spread work over greater distance so that while the total work is the same, it is not spent as quickly--kind of like walking uphill at an angle instread of straight up. Do I understand the physics correctly?

If so, then it would seem possible that a longer arm could yield a lower torque value than a shorter arm. The longer arm would have to travel farther to get the same cumulative movement/torque/force on the nut.

Or am I conflating cumulative force with torque improperly? Some other error?
 
  #22  
Old 06-26-2008 | 06:13 PM
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From: Washington. No, the other one.
Originally Posted by lawmann
Be certain to zero the torque wrench after use (set to it's lowest setting), this relieves the tension on the internal spring and keeps the accuracy much longer. Keeping it set at your last use's setting (for example 40 ft/lbs) it will over time affect spring tension and thus the torque wrench variance. You may find later your +/- 4% becoming +/-7% or more over time.
Great point lawman. Relaxing the wrench and occasionally 'exercising' it is important to keep it calibrated. Almost all foot-pound wrenches are 12", but it's simple enough to tape a small block of wood at the correct point if it is one of the longer ones.
btw beemer, I was a calibration technician in the service. Everything from the mechanical (torque wrenches and such) to electronic (o'scopes, sig generators, test meters, etc.) so most of this is just training and experience.
 
  #23  
Old 06-26-2008 | 06:23 PM
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From: Washington. No, the other one.
Originally Posted by rrcaniglia
Ancient Mariner,
Thanks for an elegant solution to checking calibration. With respect to Blimey's faux question, does he have a point? A lever allows one to spread work over greater distance so that while the total work is the same, it is not spent as quickly--kind of like walking uphill at an angle instread of straight up. Do I understand the physics correctly?

If so, then it would seem possible that a longer arm could yield a lower torque value than a shorter arm. The longer arm would have to travel farther to get the same cumulative movement/torque/force on the nut.

Or am I conflating cumulative force with torque improperly? Some other error?
No point in over-complicating it.
Torque is rotational. It's simply the force required to rotate an object around an axis. It's magnitude is the product of the force and the length of the lever arm. Measure 12" from the center of the socket, tape a small wood block at that point on the handle and measure there. Done and done.
 
  #24  
Old 06-26-2008 | 08:55 PM
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Yep.

40 pounds on the end of a one-foot lever equals 40 ft-lbs (or lb-ft, depending on who you ask). Make the lever long enough, and 40 pounds can move the world.
 
  #25  
Old 06-26-2008 | 09:47 PM
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From: Washington. No, the other one.
Originally Posted by BlimeyCabrio
Yep.

40 pounds on the end of a one-foot lever equals 40 ft-lbs (or lb-ft, depending on who you ask). Make the lever long enough, and 40 pounds can move the world.
Exactly, Archimedes! You just need a place to stand...
 


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