My wife and I just came back from an incredible 10 day vacation in Jamaica. Her 2005 MCS had been sitting in the driveway while we were away from south Florida.

Upon returning last night, we needed groceries. When I jumped in her car and turned the key, the gauges and lights came up, and the car cranked. However, it would not turn over. Immediately I began thinking the issue might be with a low battery charge, bad fuel, inoperative fuel pump, etc. so I set out to find the cause.

The battery is fine. The fuel pump seems to be working - though I am unable to hear it physically I can smell the fuel at the exhaust pipe. Next up - fire. I checked to see if it was getting spark. At this point, I must point out that I have no clue about the electrical system on this car and only made a few educated guesses.

I pulled the positive cable on the battery to force a reset on the computer, waited about 30 minutes, and the car still attempts to crank, yet will not start.

Using a test light, I determined that there was no juice coming out of the ignition coil - nor the plugs - so I ran out and purchased a replacement coil, hoping it would do the trick. No go.

Now I do not know what else to try. The vehicle was fine when we left, with it's most recent service (end of warranty, of course) about 1200 miles ago (6 weeks or so). Are there any sensors in the electrical loop which would somehow cause the issue? What is the general direction of flow within the electrical system (i.e. key, to starter, to coil, to plugs, to cylinders pumping)?

Though I cannot give it much weight, it is possible that the computer is fried, I guess... I am just hoping that there are other options to investigate prior to crossing that bridge, though I am beginning to doubt a quick fix.

Any suggestions from our resident gurus?

 

how did you check the battery?

i know of someone else who thought the battery checked out ok, then it ended up being the root problem.

 

I carried the battery with me to Pep Boys, when I purchased the replacement coil.

 

well then that's out. as long as they tested and didn't count on the indicator.

 

I had almost the exact same thing happen to me. Once the MINI battery goes below a certain charge level, the car doesn't respond like a regular car by sitting there slowly turning the starter. It just kind'a flips out and clicks rhythmically and flashes interior lights without turning the starter at all, or just dies altogether. Seems like it's some sort of weird protection circuit to keep it from receiving bad power.

The indicator on the top of my battery showed that it was fine, but when I took it to Autozone, it turned out to be bad. I swapped it out with a new one and it hasn't given me any trouble since. Did Pep Boys put it on their test rig and test it out, or just look at the indicator light?

 

same.. how did you test it? you could have 12volts but at the moment you try to start the car goes down to 5v. So you need to test the battery at the start moment.

 

hmm... I don't have a volt meter - but, the vehicle is showing absolutely no signs of low charge, for whatever that is worth. Power steering pump fires up, all gauges and lights come on nice and steady, stereo and lights work, and it cranks without hesitation. With all possible accessories powered down, the same situation persists. It is possible, but I have to wonder about how possible, given the instant, non-flagging reaction of the vehicle when the key is turned.

 

What happens when you turn the key? Mine did that at first. It acted as if it had plenty of power until you turned the key, then the whole thing ground to a halt, making weird clicking noises and flashing lights and twitching gauge needles.

I'll bet $5 it's the battery.

 

there is no hesitation, no clicking and the engine continues cranking... no lights dim, I can turn everything on full blast (radio, lights, etc) and there is no degradation in what happens when I turn the key. I sincerely doubt that it is the battery, though I know it is a possibility.

 

too late to do much more about it tonight, I guess. ~sigh~

I wish I had the electrical diagram so that I could see if there are any sensors in the line which come into play during startup... crankshaft, temp, pressure, etc... I do not know if the heat caused the issue, if it was due to a close lightning strike (we have A LOT in Ft. Lauderdale)... it is driving me nuts.

And, the rental car I got to hold us over is really bad... small 4 door dodge, no automatic windows or locks, terrible gas mileage, etc. GRRRR

 

Hmmm... Have you checked fuses, both in the driver footwell and under the hood?

 

Did you try charging the battery?

 

1. you said you did get a spark or no spark? Check your fuses 1-5 those are
for the DME engine control unit circuit. if those are ok. But still no spark
something in the control unit. The DME gets a ground signal internally if
its grounded it sends the signal to coil to fire. IF you have no fire all the
on all cyl. Then its something in the DME but check all fuses 1st.

2. when you turn the ignition to run position are all the lights on the instrument cluster


3. if so try another key. you be surpirsed the key may have lost its memory

4. if no lights come on the insturmnt panel do you have the big speedo or
navi screen. try wiggling the key, if all lights come, then you have a faulty
igntion switch. if not. hmm


Let me know what you find. how many miles on your car. how much fuel is in the tank.


Guido
Mini Tech

 

SkyShroud, in my mcs the battery was without enough charge to start the engine but the radio, interior ligths, high beam and all the lights works fine. and the light didn dim either.

the engine need a lot of power to start, and lights radio and all that doesn't. so even with a bad battery you can use all that, but you can't start the car.

anyway, I charged the battery and the car start ok.

 

luchini, Xymox and hollis3 -

The engine attempts to crank - and crank - and crank - with no dimming. I have not ruled out the battery as a possibility... but it seems to be a remote chance.

guidmini & iDiaz - I did not pull the plugs individually, but instead used a test light on the plug wires. No spark. At that point, I purchased a replacement coil, suspecting it as the culprit. After installation, still no spark. I checked the fuses in the engine compartment (paying close attn to 1-5), and all appeared to be fine - with the exception of the larger solid state fuses, which have no obvious method of checking them. With those, I simply swapped like-numbered fuses into the sockets... thinking that if one were bad, it would show that way. I have checked all interior fuses, and all are also in perfect shape.

With regards to the instrument cluster and lights, when the key is inserted and turned to the 1st position, all lights come on, and then all but a few go dark - as it normally does. Since I cannot get it to crank, I do not know if the other lights will go out once the key is successfully in the final run position. The car now has just about 48k on it, and the tank is 7/8ths full.

I have a buddy who suggested that the issue may be a fault in the anti-theft system. Both the original and spare produce the same effect - an engine which cranks but does not fire - so I do not think the issue is with the chip inside the key. He mentioned a rolling code, and stated that this issue would not register on an OBD reader (which I bought this morning).


Do you know of any methods I can use to rule this out as a possibility?

 

Does anyone have any more suggestions? If it is the alarm system, is there a way to start the car using the keys?

 

When my power steering pump went out (and drained the battery), I had to fully re-charge the battery before it would turn-over the car. Otherwise it would crank and the interior/headlights would flicker/flash and the car wouldn't turn over.

Try fully charging the battery.

 

Xymox -

The battery was assisted, at one point, by cables...

 

Same here. But until I hooked it up to a battery charger for a 35-40 minutes, it wouldn't turn over on it's own.

 

How many miles on it it? If it is under 50k the dealer will tow it free of charge.

Judging by your posts it sounds like your starter motor is getting up to full speed, in that case it probably isnt the batter. If you want to double check I know the Bentley manual specs the minimum voltage the battery is allowed to get to under cranking. Have someone crank it while you read the voltage. I dont have my manual with me (I am on vacation) but somebody else should have it.

I know you checked the spark with a test light, but I prefer the tried and true method of holding the base of the plug to something metal and looking for a spark. No Idea if this is safe to do on a modern car though... I would imagine it was though seeing how the plug is attached to the head, which goes to the block which grounds to the chassis...

 

just throwing this out there...

on an old volvo I used to have there was a 'Hall Effect Sensor' basically a crank shaft position sensor that determined when the electronic ignition would send out a spark. When it went bad, no amount of cranking, charging, jumping would help. Of course on old volvos, the way you check the hall sensor is to unplug the main coil wire and crank the engine while watching the needle of the tach, if it 'bounces' then the hall sensor is AOK...no bounce...no output from the sensor



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBpCIVALVs4

if you smell raw fuel in the exhaust then you don't have spark... I'm not sure how these cars work as far as crank position sensors or hall effect sensors etc...

 

Guys, all are assuming electrical. Engine needs three things: air, spark, fuel.
As long as you're still breathing, we can eliminate the first. You said you had indication of spark (although I, too, prefer the "pull the plug and check for spark" method), which may leave a failed fuel pump. Or fuse if you're lucky. Needs checkin', just to eliminate the possibility if nothing else.

 

What kind of keys do 05's have? Does it have a Vehicle Immobilizer System? One time my 350z wouldn't start, it would crank, all the lights would come on, everything but start up. It turned out the ignition key had to be reprogrammed with my vehicles info, the chip in the key just dumped everything and the car basically didn't recognize the key and wouldn't start...

 

ok, here's the resolution. Without a doubt, not what I expected.

To be clear, the battery seemed fine, there was no spark, and despite strong cranking, the engine never turned over.

The cause - BAD GASOLINE

How this would interrupt the spark being generated from the coil, I have no idea...


Before we went to Jamaica, I filled the car, drove for probably 20 miles, and parked it for 10 days. It turns out that the tanker carrying fuel from Port Everglades to the local Shell stations (I heard that this happened to south florida BP stations, as well) filled the 93 storage tank at the station with Diesel fuel.

So, the gasoline was a mixture of super unleaded and diesel - and the diesel was evidently pretty dirty, too. The car got a scrub down for the tank, completely new fuel lines throughout, new fuel pump, new sensors, new injectors. All told, about 6k worth of damage. Fortunately, I had my receipt from the gas purchase, and State Farm covered all but the deductible.

Akroma is supposed to be ready for pickup this afternoon... I'll let you know if I am able to find out any more tech details. Still wondering how bad fuel stopped the spark portion of the cycle, though...

 

Wow, that's a load of crap right there. I hope State Farm goes after the gas station and or Shell.