And, if so, where are mine? I thought I read on MINI USA that daytime running lights were part of the MINI and that the dealership adjusted them. I said something about them to my MA when we picked Monty up and he just nodded so I figured they were set. Well, I'll be darned if see any hint of running lights, EVER!

Am I mistaken? Did I read the website incorrectly? Am I seeing things?

Thanks - Laurie

 

The DRLs can be programmed by your dealer to come on. The default setting from the factory is to have them not come on. It's a simple change. Ask at your next servicing.

Dave

 

Laurie,

I had this done at the dealer for no charge. There is a list of other optional settings that can also be changed including shutting your sunroof with the door lock and unlocking the doors automaticly when you turn off the car. There may be a few others that also interest you - they should be listed in your manual or the dealer should have them.

Cheers

 

Make sure this is an option you definitely want, though.

I was told that once the DRLs are programmed, they cannot be unprogrammed.

If this is not true, someone please set me straight.

Thanks.

 

The DRLs can be programmed by your dealership. Now the pricing depends on your service department. They are supposed to charge $40 to change anything in the programming, but a lot of the times this will be done at no cost to you. My dealership wanted to charge me.

Also, just as easily as it is to program them on, the service department can program them off. FYI: all MY04 Minis will have thier DRL lamps programmed on at delivery per new federal regulations.

 

I did it because my insurance company said I'd get a discount... but it cost me $40 to get it done. Why it isn't the default setting I do not know...

 

Our dealer asked us prior to taking delivery if we wanted them turned on (no charge to us). they also asked about several other programming options, which I can't remember at the moment. Seems like it should be one of those items to ask when they are doing their final look over before handing over the keys.

 

Redleg, It's not the default setting because some people don't like them.

I'm not sure why some companies like VW, Subaru and GM have voluntarily taken the banner of DRLs. When the NHTSA studied them they came to the conclusion that they do not have as significant an impact in the US as they do in Canada, I remember them citing something about predominant weather/lighting conditions in more Northern lattitudes making them more affective.

I personally hate them because it takes yet another level of control away (I've had enough of big brother) and makes it more difficult to use your headlights for communication. Flashing someone to say "you go ahead" or "come on in" or "COP AHEAD, SLOW DOWN"

Thanks, but I'm smart enough to turn on my own headlights in twilight or rain... the rest of the time I'm happy to have them off.

On the flip side, if you don't MIND them, they probably do aid in being seen more often. The arguement for DRLs is stronger when it comes to smaller cars, especially Minis. They've been a requirement on motorcycles since the early 80s. The reason is that the small size of a motorcycle often leads to drivers either ignoring their presence or mis-judging their speed/distance and contributes to accidents.

Even said, I've retro-installed the European headlight switch on my BMW cycles so that I CAN shut the light off (for signaling or starting the motor with a minimum load purposes), but I ALWAYS ride with the light on (unless I'm a butthead and forget, but that's rare).

 

Kev M:

I'm not trying to pick a fight here, but I live in Canada in a city that is farther south than cities in about 12 States.

The primary benefit that I've found with DRLs is on overcast days. I'm not sure how much our lattitude has to do with it - seems like the gulf stream sends clouds your way first and then send 'em up to us. On an overcast day, when everything is kind of grey, it's really easy for cars to disappear into the asphalt. I don't know HOW many times I have seen cars pulling out to pass and then having to pull back in at the last second because they couldn't see the car in the oncoming lane as it didn't have DRLs.

Now, I always drive with my headlights on. Force of habit, I suppose. That way I can never forget to turn them on. I don't understand how having DRLs in a car is Orwellian in any way -- people forget them, or are lazy, or just don't care - but why should your car be less visible to me because you're being careless in an overcast or rainy or foggy situation?

Seems to me we should pick our 'Big Brother' battles wisely. I'd be more concerned with GM following me with GPS on its OnStar system than I ever would about DRLs. I don't think it's about control at all - it's about LOSS PREVENTION. The cheapest way to decrease the odds of someone getting into an accident. They can't stop other people from making stupid decisions while driving, but they can provide a way for me to see those people sooner and maybe avoid them.

my 2 cents... (Canadian, which is of course 0.00000002 cents American )
MH

 

Thanks everybody. I will definitely check into this when I go in for service. I always have my lights on, rain or shine. Hubby got me into the habit. I would really like the DRLs so I don't run the risk of leaving the lights on and draining my battery. Hasn't happened yet (knock wood) but ya never know. That ticks me off that I wasn't asked.

Laurie

 

We should have the right to choose. I personally don't like DRLs. I do agree with KevM - there's just too many regulations controlling what we do. That's enough said, I don't want to open that can of worms!

 

My MINI dealer asked me if I would like them. I said no way. I am smart enough to turn lights on when they need to be on. I personally find it irritating and have had them removed from my cars.

Meenee.Coopah I have a question. What is this "New Federal Regulation" that you speak of? I have not heard anything.

 

>>Kev M:
>>
>>I'm not trying to pick a fight here, but I live in Canada in a city that is farther south than cities in about 12 States. >>

Yup, but the NHTSA makes regulations for 50 states and they felt that although there might be a slight benfit to the lower light conditions of more northern lattitudes, it was not enough of a benefit to impose it upon all 50 states... especially sun-belt.

>>The primary benefit that I've found with DRLs is on overcast days. I'm not sure how much our lattitude has to do with it - seems like the gulf stream sends clouds your way first and then send 'em up to us. On an overcast day, when everything is kind of grey, it's really easy for cars to disappear into the asphalt. I don't know HOW many times I have seen cars pulling out to pass and then having to pull back in at the last second because they couldn't see the car in the oncoming lane as it didn't have DRLs. >>

NO question. They can be a benefit on overcast days, in light fog etc. But there's a downside. They're so bright on some cars (our old VW) that I would get in, start, drive off, and get a mile or two down the road before I realized the interior lights weren't on, meaning, I was driving at night WITHOUT tail-lights, because I was running with the DRLs.


>>Now, I always drive with my headlights on. Force of habit, I suppose. That way I can never forget to turn them on. I don't understand how having DRLs in a car is Orwellian in any way -- people forget them, or are lazy, or just don't care - but why should your car be less visible to me because you're being careless in an overcast or rainy or foggy situation? >>

That's cool. That's YOUR decision. Turn on the headlights or not. There have been cars in the US for 100 years. Most of us have always figured out when we need to turn on our lights. Those who can't seem to, well, perhaps we should be talking about social-darwinism for them.


>>Seems to me we should pick our 'Big Brother' battles wisely. I'd be more concerned with GM following me with GPS on its OnStar system than I ever would about DRLs.>>>

True, but at least for now you can OPT not to install a OnStar system. Which is really what I'm talking about. Freedom to choose. I don't like my choices limited. Maybe that's why I like Minis so much. I can mix-match a lot of different options.

I had a Jeep GC that I loved for a similar reason. The on-board computer let me program a whole bunch of things. Do I want the doors to lock automatically or not, do I want he headlights to come on automatically with the wipers, what maintenance interval do I want to program, do I want the lights to flash and/or the horn to beep with the remote when I lock it... etc. VERY SMART application of the technology which is already there in most cars.

>>I don't think it's about control at all - it's about LOSS PREVENTION. The cheapest way to decrease the odds of someone getting into an accident. They can't stop other people from making stupid decisions while driving, but they can provide a way for me to see those people sooner and maybe avoid them.>>

Well, yes, loss prevention and risk assessment. Fact is that if you wear a bright orange safety vest on your motorcycle there is a good chance that a driver may see you better/sooner/faster and not kill you. But of course, they still might and then you'll die looking like a complete DORK. So as a risk assesment I choose rider gear that has some retro-reflective tape on it, a good compromise and one that I CHOSE to make and wasn't FORCED to do.

Ya know, PA just repealled the Helmet law. I'll probably almost always wear one (and a full-face one much of the time too), but I'm glad we have a choice now.

I look at DRLs like that as well. And I applaud Mini for incorporating them and making them optional. Best of both worlds.

Ya, there is no need to fight over this. I'm not saying they are useless, I'm just saying I don't need it regulated.

>>my 2 cents... (Canadian, which is of course 0.00000002 cents American

 

Also, you have to take into consideration that the DRL's are using your high beam at 50% and they only come on when the hand brake is released (so you don't have a power draw when starting your car).

 

>>>>
>>Also, just as easily as it is to program them on, the service department can program them off. FYI: all MY04 Minis will have thier DRL lamps programmed on at delivery per new federal regulations.

Are you sure? My MA asked which setting I would prefer a couple days ago.

 

I think it is great that we have a choice as to whether we want DRL or not. However I would like to point out one observation. Either on MINI boards, BMW boards, or some other boards I visit, everytime the topic of DRL comes up, there are always Canadians telling everyone how much they value the benefits of DRL. Not once, have I EVER noticed a Canadian posting saying they hate DRLs.

If DRL is really that useless and annoying, don't you think at least you would get a few Canadians complaining about it!?

As to the sunbelt not needing DRL argument, I actually think DRL is very useful during extremely bright and sunny days. As I recall, the last time I drove from Miami to Key West, all along the route there are signs saying "lights on for safety". Doesn't this tell you something as well?!

I agree that a lot of DRLs were implemented poorly, thus a lot of people complain about it. I think the way MINI/BMW implemented it is perfect. I am having mine activated.

 

Katanapilot.

I know what you mean, but I'm a firm believer in Swiftian arguments, so WHERE DOES IT END?

In Cuba there are very little driving laws. As a result motorcyclists ride around with loud pipes, sirens, rotating lights, etc.

Here in PA they just enacted a "lights on in a workzone" ordinance.

At what point do they just say "you're all too dumb to drive yourself, you need to plug into the electronic roadway and the car will drive itself, that way you won't kill anyone"

I just don't like the government constantly enacting some other stupid law cause they assume everyone is an idiot that needs to be protected from himself. Take care of it a licensing, teach people to be observent and make good decisions.

I know I usually argue the extreme position, but I'll put up with a lot to maintain choices and freedom, I guess it hits me on a very base level.

Look at Europe, there are some strict laws against even WORKING ON YOUR OWN motorcycle and, I believe even on working on your own car in some areas. Why? For your own good....

_________________
She let's me drive her MCS (which is good, cause I gave it to her as a wedding present)!!!

Our Baby? - she's an 03 Elect Blue (white roof/wheels) MCS, w/ all the toys (premium, cold, h/k, Nav, xenon, fogs etc) !

 

OK. Let's be real here. How is the government infringing on your rights with DRL's? It's for the benefit of society and to reduce numbers of victims on the road. I'm not necessarily arguing in favor one way or the other - I'd have to see the stats. But, if it saves lives by drastically reducing harmful negligence, then why not?

Now, safety belts on the other hand, I feel does start encroaching upon one's personal behavior. My not wearing a seatbelt will never harm anyone else directly.

 

>>Meenee.Coopah I have a question. What is this "New Federal Regulation" that you speak of? I have not heard anything.


I received this information from my Mini Motoring advisor here in Michigan. You got me curious, so I went and checked the NHTSA website and could not find anything regarding this. One thing I did discover is that as of right now, this is a State Regulation. It could be that Michigan requires them in '04 or maybe Mini will begin to ship them over with this already programmed on it. Who knows? This would be a new(er) item and may not have anything posted on it yet.

I did find an interesting site if anyone is interested in reading about DRLs.

http://faq.auto.light.tripod.com/drl-systems.htm

 

>> OK. Let's be real here. How is the government infringing on your rights with DRL's? It's for the benefit of society and to reduce numbers of victims on the road. I'm not necessarily arguing in favor one way or the other - I'd have to see the stats. But, if it saves lives by drastically reducing harmful negligence, then why not? >>>

Ok, now I said I tend towards Swiftian arguments, meaning I either tend to sarcasm to point out the ridiculousness of a point or I take the point to the extreme to show the slippery slope. In this case, it's mostly the later.

My point is that every little encroachment on your freedom to choose how you do things inevitably opens the door for the next encroachment. The DRLs are not a big deal (my major objection is making it harder for non-verbal communication with another vehicle). And I feel it is un-necessary because drivers should be smart enough to figure out when they need to turn headlights on (so my answer is educate don't legislate).

"If it saves lives by drastically reducing harmful negligence"

Boy that's a stretch. There is no indication it would. Common sense would say it probably reduces the number of accidents when buttheads pull out in front of a vehicle too quickly closing the distance, but it still is the driver's responsibility not to hit the vehicle in front of them (except in some rare instances). So it behooves ME as the driver already on the road to either pay attention and/or turn my lights on when necessary. It also would behoove ME as the driver pulling out to be aware and do my best to look.

Common sense might also say that wearing helmets around your house and in the shower might "drastically reduce" deaths from head trauma caused by slips and falls, but I would be a drastic encroachment on your freedom to require it, right? It's not the governments duty to protect you from yourself.

>>>Now, safety belts on the other hand, I feel does start encroaching upon one's personal behavior. My not wearing a seatbelt will never harm anyone else directly. >>>

AHHHHHH, now let me point out when/where you are DEAD WRONG.

As the driver of a vehicle, IF you start to loose control and/or have to make a drastic maneuver due to your own negligence or unforeseen circumstances the use of a seat belt will keep you physically behind the wheel where you MIGHT continue to have a positive outcome on the situation (continued steering or braking input) which may contribute to protecting pedestrians, drivers/passengers of other vehicles, passengers of your vehicle.

Similarly, wearing it in the passenger seat of your vehicle will keep you off the driver contributing to the above scenario.

So in those two instances only your wearing the seatbelt protects other people and is therefore justifiable.

I guess by the same argument, requiring someone to turn the headlights on in poor light conditions (which I generally believe is already the case) has the same affect. And therefore is already addressed.

Draconian laws requiring DRLs would not significantly contribute to the situation.

What do we say next, too many people speed, therefore all cars/trucks/motorcycles should be throttle limited to the speed limit? Hey, it's only a matter of time before cars could receive signals from speed limit signs and constantly adjust the governor to prevent you from ever speeding.

Legislatures seem to buy the argument that speed kills and they certainly have laws concerning it, so if enforcement isn't enough (such as could be done for headlights in low light conditions) then I guess they should just equip cars to take away our freedom to choose whether or not we break the speed limit.

And that slippery slope is why I'm against ramming DRLs down our throats.


_________________
She let's me drive her MCS (which is good, cause I gave it to her as a wedding present)!!!

Our Baby? - she's an 03 Elect Blue (white roof/wheels) MCS, w/ all the toys (premium, cold, h/k, Nav, xenon, fogs etc) !

 

Meenee.Coopah thank you for the information. I too went looking and found nothing.