R50/R53 :: Hatch Talk (2002-2006) Cooper (R50) and Cooper S (R53) hatchback discussion.

R50/53 Need Help! EP transmission and lots of error codes...

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  #51  
Old 04-22-2023, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by deepgrey
Does this help?


Yes, that may help. That looks like the smaller of the 2 DME connectors. But my molded DME shows way higher PIN numbers on that side so I thought it was the other connector which has a pin 29 and 30 according to the molded in PIN numbers. listed in Bentley.

Does your book show the pin out?
 
  #52  
Old 04-22-2023, 05:36 PM
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I pulled this out of the TIS documents I have. It looks like it's showing CAN on pins 29 and 30 of X6004. I do have a pinout for X6000, too. I'll grab it in a sec.


 
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Old 04-22-2023, 05:39 PM
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  #54  
Old 04-22-2023, 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted by deepgrey
EDIT. I’m on wrong pins in this pic.



OK thank you!

Still having some confusion on my readings.

Unfortunately the molding in PIN numbers on X60004 do not match the pin out. They are WAY higher. Thus, I’m unable to confirm I’m in 29 and 30. Is the pic a birdseye or looking into the connector on harness?

See attached pic. Shorted across pins 29 and 30 of DME?



 

Last edited by audihere; 04-22-2023 at 06:07 PM.
  #55  
Old 04-22-2023, 06:04 PM
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OK!

Getting 116 Ohms from X60004 back to Speedo!!



 
  #56  
Old 04-22-2023, 06:11 PM
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Aha, so then that means the Bentley pin numbers are looking into the connector on the DME, right? The one with the male pins, that is.
 
  #57  
Old 04-22-2023, 06:30 PM
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I don’t think it makes much difference at this point, but I found the actual pinout.



 
  #58  
Old 04-22-2023, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by deepgrey
Aha, so then that means the Bentley pin numbers are looking into the connector on the DME, right? The one with the male pins, that is.
Yes.

BUT, in the diagram, it shows the plastic pull lever on the connector side (which is confusing).



 
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Old 04-22-2023, 06:55 PM
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I may have found an issue in the EMS2000 (which I think is the ECU).

Pins 29-30 CAN Hi to CAN Lo are measuring Open. 2.8 MegaOhms.

I don’t know if I’m interpreting this right but I think there should be a 120 Ohm resistor inside the ECU on these pins right??



 
  #60  
Old 04-22-2023, 07:11 PM
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Yeah, that connector diagram still has me second-guessing myself on which way it is. I haven't seen anything in the Bentley confirming orientation though, which is bothering me. Surely it's buried somewhere in the book.

Originally Posted by audihere
I may have found an issue in the EMS2000 (which I think is the ECU).
Yes, ECU/DME/EMS2000(or MS5150 if it's a late production car) are the same thing.

Originally Posted by audihere
Pins 29-30 CAN Hi to CAN Lo are measuring Open. 2.8 MegaOhms.
That seems very ungood... Think you're sure about connector orientation? From looking at the wiring diagram, I don't think you could get 116 Ohms or whatever on the harness side if you had it mirrored though, but I'm not positive.

Originally Posted by audihere
I don’t know if I’m interpreting this right but I think there should be a 120 Ohm resistor inside the ECU on these pins right??
That's the way I've been interpreting it as well. It sounds like all the modules are in parallel on the bus, and the DME and IKE each have 120 Ohm resistors across the lines (CAN hi and CAN lo), while the other modules have a very high impedance across the lines.
 
  #61  
Old 04-22-2023, 07:18 PM
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Oh, but either way something's wrong because you checked both possibilities, right? One set of pins is basically a dead short and the other is an open circuit, where you should be seeing 120 Ohms somewhere?
 
  #62  
Old 04-22-2023, 07:26 PM
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This bit from the TIS is bothering me. Isn't this what you experienced when you disconnected the DME and read codes? Specifically the third paragraph.

 
  #63  
Old 04-22-2023, 07:41 PM
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Just noticed with key out of car, one fog light and one parking light are stuck on.



 
  #64  
Old 04-22-2023, 07:44 PM
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Another question. When you measured... 110 Ohms (I think?) earlier, was the DME connected? The measurement you took before you checked the resistance looking into the harness side of X60004 at the DME, that is.
 
  #65  
Old 04-22-2023, 07:48 PM
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Originally Posted by audihere
Just noticed with key out of car, one fog light and one parking light are stuck on.


I... huh? Aren't those run by the BCM?
 
  #66  
Old 04-22-2023, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by deepgrey
Another question. When you measured... 110 Ohms (I think?) earlier, was the DME connected? The measurement you took before you checked the resistance looking into the harness side of X60004 at the DME, that is.
Just checked it.

Measuring from Tach plug:

Without DME plugged in 114 Ohms.

With DME plugged in 126 Ohms.
 
  #67  
Old 04-22-2023, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by audihere
Just checked it.

Measuring from Tach plug:

Without DME plugged in 114 Ohms.

With DME plugged in 126 Ohms.
Hmm. At first glance that doesn't seem good. The only thing I'm wondering about is how the tach is connected internally to the speedo. I found the wiring diagram for the CAN bus, but it's not immediately clear to me whether you should see 120 Ohms or 60 on that line. Some documents suggest that everything on the CAN bus should be in parallel, right? And it sort of seems like the tach is on the CAN bus along with the IKE, the ABS module, the DME, the TCU, and the steering angle sensor, but then it isn't always listed there. But the wiring diagram shows it connected through the IKE.



 
  #68  
Old 04-22-2023, 08:15 PM
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Going to start looking at CAN wires on Transmission module A7000.



 
  #69  
Old 04-22-2023, 08:27 PM
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Originally Posted by deepgrey
Hmm. At first glance that doesn't seem good. The only thing I'm wondering about is how the tach is connected internally to the speedo. I found the wiring diagram for the CAN bus, but it's not immediately clear to me whether you should see 120 Ohms or 60 on that line. Some documents suggest that everything on the CAN bus should be in parallel, right? And it sort of seems like the tach is on the CAN bus along with the IKE, the ABS module, the DME, the TCU, and the steering angle sensor, but then it isn't always listed there. But the wiring diagram shows it connected through the IKE.


That’s a great diagram.

One thing that’s really been bothering me is we don’t see any resistance between pins 6 and 14 on the OBD port. Is it on that diagram?
 
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Old 04-22-2023, 08:31 PM
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Originally Posted by deepgrey
Hmm. At first glance that doesn't seem good. The only thing I'm wondering about is how the tach is connected internally to the speedo. I found the wiring diagram for the CAN bus, but it's not immediately clear to me whether you should see 120 Ohms or 60 on that line. Some documents suggest that everything on the CAN bus should be in parallel, right? And it sort of seems like the tach is on the CAN bus along with the IKE, the ABS module, the DME, the TCU, and the steering angle sensor, but then it isn't always listed there. But the wiring diagram shows it connected through the IKE.


Do you have A7000 trans module connector diagram. I see the CAN wires but can’t tell where they are in the connector to probe.
 
  #71  
Old 04-22-2023, 08:45 PM
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I haven't found the OBD connector, but the pinout is on page 13-99 of the Bentley. It looks like pins 6 and 14 are unused.
 

Last edited by deepgrey; 04-23-2023 at 12:40 AM. Reason: Maybe I had it right after all?
  #72  
Old 04-22-2023, 08:52 PM
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This one?



 
  #73  
Old 04-22-2023, 09:04 PM
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Originally Posted by audihere
Just noticed with key out of car, one fog light and one parking light are stuck on.


Only in the front, and the fog light below is on too, or just the two parking lights that are visible in the pic?
 
  #74  
Old 04-22-2023, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by RB-MINI
Only in the front, and the fog light below is on too, or just the two parking lights that are visible in the pic?
it was just the two lights on that side of the car. But I then noticed the rear tail light on the same side was also on. All of this with key out and light switch off.

Power cycled the key to position 2 and lights went off.
 
  #75  
Old 04-22-2023, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by RB-MINI
Only in the front, and the fog light below is on too, or just the two parking lights that are visible in the pic?

Nice catch. If the rear are on, too, are you thinking the indicator stalk is set to right turn, and that feature that lights up one side solid when the car is off is activated?
 
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