Perfectly put!

 

Sporty Wagon?

 

Shooting Brake!

 

I tend to agree with the sporty, but not a sports car crowd. To me a true sports car is a 2 seater, rear or front drive, room for maybe 2 small travel bags, and to be a really truly "sports car", a rag top, but that's just my take.

That said, if I don't look in the rear view mirror, open the sun roof, and concentrate only on what is in front of the steering wheel, our Clubbie S sure feels like a sports car

Mark

 

I guess I'm just less particular /for once!

To me, a sports car is one that inspires you to drive it, to push your and it's limits, that excites you when it responds, and encourages you to keep the exhiliration going, and leaves you exhausted with a smile when it's all done....umm...what were we talking about again?

 

Alphawave, I have to agree with you, and our Clubbie, and all the other MINIs we have owned, or motored in do all those things. But one other thing a sports car must not be IMO, is practical in anyway, besides getting you from point to point in a sporty fashion. Now a Clubman does that too, but not with 2 bales of insulation in the boot, like I just did motoring home from Lowes

Mark

 

if it was a true sports car the ins. would be much higher :(

 

Probably.

When I bought my WRX my wife really didn't know anything about cars. She got a shock when she called the insurance company. Keep in mind we had insured more than 20 cars over 25 years so this is a 'no big deal' kinda thing. The insurance rep, when told what the car was said, "Could you please confirm that this is a Subaru WRX." When my wife said yes, the rep said, in an even voice, "Is this car going to be raced or are rides going to be sold?" My wife asked for the question to be repeated because she'd never heard such a thing before. The insurance agent said they had only seen this required a few times and not even on Corvettes. They both laughed and then my wife almost choked on the insurance rate (male, married, over 45, with kids). Needless to say I loved that car, and my daughter, who has it now, also loves it.

cahrlie

 

Clubman - not a hatch.

Shooting Brake.

 

gotta say i disagree with ya on that one, it sure as heck is not a wagon. Using euro lingo to make a car seem sporty is cool if it makes you feel better, and i am not trying to be a jerk, I love my mini very much and it is fast and fun for me. But driving a s2000, z4 or even a 914 porsche is just a different feel.

not just because a car handles is it a sports car, perhaps it is just a good handling car? To each his or her own i suppose

 

I think almost every single person on here that's insured it has had it classified as a station wagon.

I feel special, it's like a little tiny station wagon that can blow the doors off of the parents in their SUVs. The little MINI that could

Hot hatch might be close, but then, it does have the barn doors

Hot barn doors?

Sounds like something I shouldn't say in public

 

Nope not a sports car.

 

I just checked with WIKIPEDIA. ref: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sports_car .
According to their definition, the Clubman is technically not a sports car, but rather, as mentioned several time already, a sporty car.
I feel that the question weather or not a Clubman is a sports car is a question of personal perspective.
For those of us who have been trying to 'coin' a term to describe the Clubman, How about SPORTS WAGON? It is a term used to describe several European built wagons (for example, Audi + BMW make sports wagons) and while the term doesn't suggest the sexiness of sports car, it is a very accurate label.

 

Sports... wagon.

OK, Sporty wagon.

Sports car? Nope.

Except maybe JCW clubman.

 

Yah, but Audi and BMW's wagons have true engines to meet the whole performance aspect of a sports car. The audi RS6 wagon is a 420hp 4.2l V8....or maybe 580hp from their 5.0l V10.....now THAT is sports car territory (and beyond).

A small economy-sized 1.6L that puts out 160hp? That's right up there with PT cruisers and we won't begin to bring up the Chevy HHR which has more hp and a very similar 0-60 time as the clubman

Our cars handle pretty well, and they're a blast to drive....they're just not sports cars or sports wagons. They are nice hatchbacks/wagons that are fun to cruise around in

 

[quote=Rally@StanceDesign;2553916]Yah, but Audi and BMW's wagons have true engines to meet the whole performance aspect of a sports car. The audi RS6 wagon is a 420hp 4.2l V8....or maybe 580hp from their 5.0l V10.....now THAT is sports car territory (and beyond). =quote]

I can't disagree with your opinion. However, my wife drives a 325 and, IMHO, my Clubman is at least as sporty as her car. I test drove a 128 on the same day I tested the Clubman (both Justa and S) and was not as impressed with it as the MINI.
But that is just my opinion.

 

If you have confidence, connection, and a streak of competitiveness when driving, you're in a sports car. If the feedback from your feet and hands pleases you, you're in a sports car. If your journey trumps your destination, you're in a sports car. Lastly, if your car has a Sport button, you're in a sports car.

 

On a good stretch of road, it drives like a sports car... but it is not a sports car. It's a matter of context... the more time you spend driving all-out sports cars -- cars that were designed with the majority of their design brief focused on performance and driver satisfaction and that, subsequently, make minimal concessions to practicality, storage space, etc. -- the easier it is to understand the difference. The person who wrote "hot hatch" up above has it right... it's a term that isn't used as often in North America but the euros have lots of these things and that's indeed the right nomenclature.

Just consider the original VW mkI GTI -- sports car? No. Could it do much of what a sports car could (objective performance numbers) and give much of the driving engagement a sports car could (subjective feel)? Yes. Better yet, consider the original mini design brief - revolutionary packaging for an affordable compact car, that just so happened to corner fantastically, not the other way around.

 

my 325 is not a sports car either

 

And I would agree....your 325 isn't a sports wagon either. Besides the M-powered cars, the 3 series really isn't a sports car. It's their average transportation line of vehicles.

 

Rally,were you seriously grouping the HHR with the Clubman? I thought the HHR handled like Jeep Compass..

 

Sorta. Not really grouping it right along with the HHR, just comparing them for a second. I was using it to point out that our car really doesn't have an engine that was meant for sports car territory. When your car is only as fast as something like a PT cruiser or an HHR, you don't drive a sports car

Technically, those three are in similiar class based on many things such as their engine performance, retro styling, their hatchback/wagon designation, and their price range. The MINI just happens to blow them away when it comes to handling.

 

I'm pretty certain that I haven't seen any authoritative source prohibiting sportscars from having front wheel drive.

On the other hand , 2 vertically hinged rear doors and a bubble shaped top for extra headroom fairly clearly identifies the clubman as a traditional european small delivery van

 

Thanks for clearing that up, but I felt the response of the HHR, acceleration wise was in a different class than the CooperSClubman. The cab on the HHR seemed much smaller although it probably isn't Cu.Ft.wise. By the way, I really like some of your designs also...

 

That's the whole reason this thread exists, right? There's no official definition.