but I'll lend any of my cars to anyone I know and trust who wants to use them....

I get to sample a lot of fine cars at a media even each year. One thing I've got to say is that the user interfaces are more baffling each year. I sat in an Audi that has the start button work if the key fob was in your pocket, but not in the dash (then you had to press it a second time to start), manumatics that didn't shift at redline in sport mode and those that did, and a MB SL550 where I was afraid to change the radio station because I didn't know how to get back to the audio screen from the nav and vice versa!

Anyway, with all the added electronics, I think things will get worse before the get better. Just like the iDrive in BMWs...

Matt

 

I've only had my Clubman for a few weeks, and I have gotten used to the controls, but I agree they could be better. Just remember, BMW had a lot to do with the design, and they gave us the 'I' drive, which every road test I read disliked.

 

I now have about 8,000 miles on the car - not unhappy with the controls at all; just a few "habit movements" to get used to.

 

I have the nav system, which is essentially iDrive. If anything, I think it actually makes the stereo/Bluetooth/computer easier to operate. It's really easy to use if you take about 10 minutes to learn how it works.

edit: Here is an article about the theory behind iDrive. Having thought about it, I much prefer it over a touch screen setup that most would consider more intuitive.

 

we had to have the BC module reprogrammed because of the erratic windows. When we got the car back, all bluetooth pairings were wiped. Doing the pairing again isn't done via the method in the users manual anymore... Took some time screwing with it to get it to pair.

Now, maybe the changes were warrented, maybe not, but not giving updated instructions after the software upgrade is just bad business, and the sequence was far from intuitive. They managed to put some text into the gizmo that would tell you to read the manual. Seems if they could do that, they could program in the steps as well!

Anyway, I'm betting that a lot of the drop in the JDP intial quality survey is due to the sucky center stack...

Matt

 

I've really never had a problem with the controls on my Clubman. It didn't even take a period of getting used to them for me. Really the only thing that I still don't like are the buttons for controlling the radio; the buttons that the writer of that article describes as "half buttons" that are sort of ridges. I don't like the design of those, but it's not something I would complain about to anyone. Even those are easy enough to deal with.

 

I think a lot of manufacturers are finding it hard to combine all the technology they provide into a single intuitive UI. As someone with UI design experience I know that it is tough to start with something that is super stripped down and works great only to then find that "dang, we need to add this or that". Imagine how it must be to design a set of controls that goes all the way from a base car to one with Nav and BT and things of this nature.

We typically get NAV in all our cars for the streamlined look of the interior versus suctions cups and cables. On the Clubman, it was also necessary to make the iPod controls worth while. Regardless, every car we've had with such setups is a PIA for the first couple weeks while you learn the system. Doesn't matter if its Toyota, BMW, Mini, Nissan, VW, Volvo or aftermarket...just the way it is. So we deal with it and then within a couple weeks have it down pat.

I am not aware of anyone doing it superbly these days. I think if you look back at cars from the 50's you kind of saw this as well where they were feeling out how things should work with power windows and AC or perhaps they were just trying to be too stylish. Maybe it will settle down eventually or it may just continue like this and other things forvever.

Think of the last time you bought a cell phone and could use everything perfectly on day one....

 

I wish they would do the following:
1) Come back with the chronopack gauge (like the R53 has)
2) Replace the speedo with a gauge cluster consisting of (a) volt meter; (b) water temp and; (c) turbo boost

Radio would revert back to a conventional design

Am thinking about doing the above to my R56 myself. If, and when, I do this I will post how-to with materials, etc.

Robb in Germany

 

sure, every user can eventually use the controls. But look at why the iPhone is a hit... It's not the technology, it's the user interface. These can be done well or poorly. I agree with the article, the Mini is done on the poor end of the spectrum.

Yes, complexity makes the task harder. Look at iDrive. Most (not all) hated the first design. Now that it has the four buttons as well, the reviews are getting much better. This is an example of improving the interface of an admittedly complicated system.

On another point, touch screens in cars suck. You have to be looking at them to use them well. The tactile feedback provided by buttons and other location ques allows for operation without looking at the interface.

Anyway, I bet that we see a significant improvement in the center stack design with the MY 2011 model. At least I hope so....

Matt

 

That's what I was thinking, except it's exactly what's keeping me from buying the car. I want a Clubman, and my 200k mi old commuter is getting long in the tooth - perfect job for a Cooper Clubman. I've driven them, specced 'em out, priced 'em out, and nearly pulled the trigger a few times. What's holding me back? Coming out of my car, I simply can not live with the interior (mostly center stack) design/interface.

I was thrilled to find out there will be an update! If it's comfy and intuitive (to me), then that will be the last hurdle.

mb

 

I think it is unlikely there will be a big change in the center stack. If you look at how long it took BMW to make the Idrive user friendly, and keep in mind the German mindset that their products are all good, I think small changes is all you will see. They consider that huge speedo to be a brand marker.

 

So if they thought it was good, why the heck did they change it so much from the first gen?????!!!!!!! They did a drastic change then, so my expectation as a paying customer is that they fix it. No fixy, no money.

I agree, though - it probably won't be groundbreaking, but it might be enough for me.

mb

 

from the huge speedo to be a brand identifier to the center mounted speedo being a brand identifier.

If one were to read all the reviews of the car written since the R56 and later cars came out, the dinner plate sized speedo and center stack are the items that gets close to universal negative comments. It only takes an IQ of about 7 to realize that something needs to be done. No matter what the intent was, it surely missed it's mark. It could be improved a lot while still maintaining the center speedo.

Too bad they waited till the 2011 model year to have a chance of fixing it.

Matt

 

I think this article (and the many 'universal negative comments') are much ado about nothing, and I have to question the IQ of those that insist everything must be generic and the same look and function as everyone else. They deplore the fact MINI dares to be different, and use subjective opinion (along with words like atrocious, gaudy, ugly) to denigrate what many MINI users see as unique, and functionally intact. 'The Other Button' is a classic example...it is a Navigation/Input button..not an ON/OFF/Volume button, which indeed should be separated from Nav/Input button. The fact they decided to place the ON/OFF/Vol buttom closer to your shifting hand is genius to some, and sacrelege to others who are used to additional *****/buttons. I'm all for reducing the number of *****/buttons, and placing the burden of the inputs to menues, aside from the obvious functions like ON/OFF/Vol. Maybe MINI is just ahead of the curve in integrating the bulk of the technology into a suitable interface, and the low IQ's just need to catch up. There's always room to improve, but to suggest the console detracts from the MINI experience is over-stated. It is indeed part of the MINI experience, and every interface has to be learned to be used, appreciated, or rejected.

 

Well, I don't like it much either. Some of the comments I get are amusing, but that is about all that is good. I, too, hope they will change it, but I am not going to benefit, as I am not going to buy another new car for that. I will just concentrate on the road and think pure thoughts.
I guess I am not smart enough to appreciate the wonderful technology?

 

This position effectivly defines what Mini does as "Fine" or even "good". Why can't some say that there are things that Mini has done that aren't optimal?

I guess we can all say that the Mini world is perfect and everything is just fine, or we can also acknowledge that many who are experienced in areas like this that are a bit more objective in thier views can offer some constructive criticism that has some value.

To put it more bluntly, I really like new Minis, and I think the center stack design blows.

I guess I too am not smart enough to appreciate the wonderful technology.

Matt

 

I love the new MINI's, and I think the center stack is cool, but could use afew enhancements (toggles higher, away from drink cups, for one), but it's far from 'blows', imho.

I was addressing those critics (blogs,wragmags,etc) that simply love to rip on MINI's centerstack design, with readers blindly swallowing it as fact. It's different..yes..now they need to get over it. Or we could go back to the two-**** stereo cassette DIN format, since it's 'intuitive' (the most overused word in this new century).

 

it is possible that almost every review publication rips the center stack design just to make contraversy, or it's possible that they know what they're talking about because they review tons of cars and see the variety that is out there and have a wide base of experience from which to draw valid conclusions.

I'm guessing that many will just have to agree to disagree on this one, and that's OK.

But I'm betting that we're gonna see changes in this area with the mid cycle refresh, and I'm betting that they will be well recieved (if they're actually an improvement).

Matt

 

Agree with the latter, definitely. There are some very basic design flaws with the R56 center stack, imo. And there is nothing wrong with the interface/design being "intuitive", that's the whole point of "good" interface design. There shouldn't be a need to fumble around with switches, or for there to be a "period of adjustment" simply for the sake of visual design (e.g. trying to squeeze the radio and all of its controls within the frame of the large speedo and only to fail miserably by using thin buttons and forcing the volume button out completely and separately below it).

I don't buy the "oh grow up you'll get used to it eventually" BS excuse. That is simply covering up/is an excuse for, yes, "bad" design. Which is the whole point of the article.

My 2 cents.

 

I suspect both...they can't always gush about anything without being made out to be the industry patsies they are, so they nitpick and find faults to extreme at times, just to make read-worthy 'print'. Their conclusions (still subjective opinion) are only as valid as an actual user with experience will sustain, nothing else. Again, what they like and want isn't necessarily what I value and want...I prefer to test and experience it myself, and then decide for myself. In this case, to say the centerstack detracts from the MINI experience is way over-stated..there is simply too many positives, overwhelming positives, to make that even possible.

Certainly! That's what a forum is for.

I'd be all for it, as it will likely enhance my MINI experience, but even if it somehow got a little worse, it wouldn't seriously affect the exhiliration and desire I have to go motor with Pelle.

 

that the woman who was lead on the center stack isn't with Mini anymore... This is second hand news, so I appologize if it's in error.

Matt

 

Starting from the bottom of the stack coming up...
- Sport Button/DTC
1. Why all the way down there? This should be up near the driver. Placement of this seems like an after thought. Sure its near the transmission but the DTC button is all the way around the other side partly obscured by the shifter (manual transmission only). Should I take my eyes off the road again and hunt around for this button should I need to press it? Maybe I'll take my hand off the wheel and feel around for it...

- Bank of switches.
1. You never know the on/off state of the switch without looking at the Speedo. Driving in fog or in heavy traffic in heavy rain, you don't want to take your eyes off the road for ONE second to see if you hit the right switch. Since you never know the state of the switch you'll always have to take your eyes off the road and check the speedo to confirm. Obviously, this comment does not apply to the window switches.
2. Confusing...which one is the rear fog vs. the front fog?! I had to get out and check the first time I drove her and then several more times after that because I forget. (I like to drive with the front fog as DRL)
3. This should be a little higher up.

- Climate Controls (standard AC).
1. Inconsistent icons for main dial. Some just have arrows, some have people with arrows. Can the air come out someplace else that's not directed towards a person?

- Radio Volume
1. Disjointed, seems like an afterthought during placement.

- CD
1. Seems okay.

- Main (obnoxious) gauge
1. Much too large. Geared for everyone but the driver. Put it in front of me or throw it up on a HUD... you go where you look! The R53 setup was much nicer IMO from an aesthetic point of view.
2. Radio preset buttons, hard to tell which to press when in USB mode. Also nothing tactile to go by when you can't take your eyes off the road (seems to be my running theme)
An extra set of controls on the underside of the MFSW would have been nice to accommodate another set of radio functions.
3. Radio/BT/EQ/etc. menus seems okay
4. Gas gauge is okay since it sips gas (+1 for MINI)
5. Status lights okay except for the front/rear fogs (which is which?)

- Vents
1. Okay

- Hazard
1. Could be a different color to make it stand out, red perhaps?

- MFSW
1. Okay

- Right stalk
1. Rear window wiper Auto mode...is that activated with the main wiper? Should there be a little "A" on the rear wiper indicating that position?
2. Text on the back side of the control. Who's that for?!

- Left Stalk
1. Lights okay

- RPM gauge
1. 0,0 what does that reset? The Trip? MPG? Everything?
If it resets the trip, how about putting the trip right above it so we know its connected? I was trying to reset my MPG and I pressed that button in hopes it would reset it...but it didn't. How about "Trip 0,0" AHHH! I know, I know....read the manual...for a reset button ?!
2. Some of the digital readouts are too small. Since this gauge does most of the work, it should have been a bit bigger.
3. Red line is hard to see in my peripheral when I'm coming up on it.

- Dipstick
1. Need I say more?!

- Seats
1. Seat bolsters adjusters. These are hidden, maybe move to the outside?
2. Seat release is hidden from view.

- Emergency Brake
1. Somewhat blocked by the arm rest. I should have a clear shot at that puppy.

- Door
1. x2 for the door pull was strange at first but that's a European thing?

- Jack
1. Pretty cool. At first, I said "..No way am I going to use this!" But its a simple elegant design. You can tell which way the jack goes, the handle is attached, crank it and you're off! No instructions are stuck on the jack, because it doesn't need any! American cars have huge instructions stuck to the storage compartment explaining how to use the jack. They should put the guy who designed this in charge of the interior controls!

- Overhead bank of switches
1. Too many "light" switches. If you don't use them often, you'll need to throw one or two to refresh your memory. There should be 3 IMO, one map light for the driver and passenger and a center light for the cabin. They can move the mood lighting to a "setting".

There are just so many things wrong with the design of the interior. Its not obvious, its not intuitive, its not even cute or kitchy. Its just bad design. It seemed to me that they went out of their way to annoy me.

Its a great little car though. Its tons of fun. When you're at speed, in sport mode, I feel connected with this car. I wish the rest of the interior was more "connected".

If they made MINI into a plane. How many people would have died trying to fly this thing? "...now where the heck are the landing lights...which are the nose and which are the tail lights?!

 

Quite a few I'd suspect...it doesn't look all that 'intuitive':

 

BTW, SmokeM...the main thing we agree on is the dipstick...I cussed out loud the first time I tried to get a reading off it.