So for the past two weeks my 08 cooper S has been in the shop getting a repair to the HVAC system. (parts ordered, not correct, new part backordered, came from Germany, HOPEFULLY pick up the car this afternoon.)

anyway, my loaner has been an '09 Cooper Clubman. Premium, cold, and convenience packages, with the auto trans.

so here is my unsolicited review of the thing:

First thing I noticed right away: The gas mileage is worse than on my cooper S with six speed. Second thing: The automatic transmission, even using the paddle shifters, is soul-sucking.

Other than that, I like the car, but I wouldn't buy one for myself.

I desperately wish I had ordered the convenience package on my car, though. The IPOD adapter isn't perfect, (navigation through my 16gb touch is difficult, and if you stop and get out of the car and come back, you can't get to the album you were listening to without scrolling through the entire list again) but it is significantly better than the aux input that I have to use. The bluetooth works great, I love that, and I really, really like the convenience opening or whatever it is called. I put the key fob in my jacket pocket and haven't touched it in two weeks!

It drives nice, and honestly I think the power is not bad at all. But, here's where it gets dicey for me.

The big thing that the clubman offers over the hatch is the convenience of the barn doors and the third side door. (and a little more legroom in the back seat). I have two girls, ages 4 and 8. Up until last year at this time, we were a two MINI family, and when we replaced my wife's MINI, we looked at a clubman but decided against it. I'm glad we did.

The barn doors and space in the back is nice, but I find that I need more room behind my car in the garage to open them to load the boot. once I open the barn doors, I'm 'trapped' behind the car until I close one, then move over and close the other.

Similar issue with the side door. On my Cooper S, the kids can crawl in through one side or the other with the door at the second 'detent' opening, which is as far as we can open it without hitting the other car in the garage. With the clubman, we have to do the same thing and don't get to use the third door, because you can't get in with the main door at the second detent. It actually seems harder to get in than my car.

Now, when we are out in a big parking lot, it is certainly more convenient.

FWIW, once they get in there, the extra legroom in the back IS noticeable, and both of the kids want me to get a clubman now (but I think that is because they like the cupholders back there more than anything.)

 

So is the problem with the car or with what's packed into your garage?

 

LOL!

I'd say that a bigger garage needs to be ordered.

I have none of these issues in my two-car garage with my wife's Impreza parked beside me. I have about three feet in front of my and I can still get the barn doors open. (Although I might be 'trapped' between them if I left the car parked that far back.) If it's tight, just open the garage door. (Doesn't everyone have an automatic garage door opener?)

If you can get into the back of a non-Clubman using the front doors only, seems to me there's no reason to complain (too strong a word, I know) about any issues with the clubdoor. Just use the front door like you would with the standard MINI.

Speaking of which, I got to ride in the back of my own Clubman the other day. My first time back there -- not counting getting in once in the showroom to see what it was like. Getting out, I couldn't easily reach the front door opener to get it open so I could open the clubdoor. I'd say it might be an issue for a parent with kids young enough to be back there without someone in the front passenger seat to open the door to let them out. But no more so than in a standard MINI with no on in the front passenger seat to let them out.

--
Darryl

 

My garage is very clean. It is a standard two car garage (so not huge, but not bad.) I just found that it needs another foot or so (plus the extra foot that the car takes up) to open the barn doors. I have an auto garage door opener, but I prefer not to have the sub - zero windchill hit me if I can help it!

It isn't a huge deal, I'm just commenting that it isn't significantly more convenient than my car in that way.

 

Not complaining about the club door so much as just stating that for me, it doesn't add that much convenience over the less expensive and slightly better gas mileage hatchback. I'm sure for others it fits the bill nicely!

 

Fortunately, you get to turn it back in for your less expensive and slightly better gas mileage hatchback.

 

I've owned my Clubman for 3 months and rarely use the 3rd door. My 8 year old clambers into the back seat through the drivers side 90% of the time. I could happily live without the 3rd door.

For me the extra leg room in the back is important - I'm not tall, and I don't push the seat all the way back, but even then, my daughter has just enough legroom behind the drivers seat. Can't see her in a non-Clubman, but we've never tried.

+1 on the convenience access or whatever. I LOVE not having to use my keys for anything. I'm going to put a keypad deadbolt on my house and garage (detached) so I never have to use any keys again!

 

yeah. it was good to have it for a couple weeks, though. I'd been trying to figure out what my next car would be (this one, which I love, has been in for a LOT of warranty work and I'm very concerned about keeping it when it is out of warranty).

I always thought a clubman might be the thing. still fun like a mini, but quite a bit more convenient. as it turns out, in my situation, it isn't significantly more convenient.

so it will either be another hatch or a 1 series, I guess...

 

I guess I really don't see what you're trying to accomplish, here.

You don't like the triptronic transmission (they seem to work fine for F1 drivers), it's a little more expensive, your hatchback gets "slightly better gas mileage", and it doesn't fit in your garage.

I have a feeling you'd probably get a warmer response if you posted this over in Coupe Talk.

 

Just relaying my experiences. thought I made it clear that it just didn't work FOR ME. didn't mean to get people's panties in a wad. wow.

fwiw, F1 cars use a fully automated manual, not anything even remotely similar to a MINI's tiptronic. VW and Audi's DSG is more like the F1. No torque converter.

My wife had an Audi A3 with the DSG, and it was FUN. The paddles actually did something, the shifts were immediate and direct, and there was no annoying torque converter lag. But the transmission is the same for the cooper and clubman, so I don't really see why a clubman owner specifically would be upset by my opinion.

As for the gas mileage, I was surprised that my Cooper S got better mileage than a Cooper Clubman. And it is like 3-4 mpg better. I expected that to not be the case. I suspect the automatic transmission is the culprit.

Again, didn't mean to offend, just offering my experiences. There may be people on this forum reading the clubman section because they are thinking about moving from a hatch to a clubman, and I thought this might offer one guy's perspective. I really wanted to like the car enough that I'd decide to order one for my next vehicle. Turns out, I still prefer the hatch. That's all.

 

I doubt it. I'm sure you can, but very few can shift more efficiently than a computer-controlled automatic transmission.

Maybe you should give us the dimensions of your garage and how you have your vehicles positioned just in case someone is wondering if it will fit in theirs.

Should I go over to Coupe Talk and start a thread about the reasons I didn't choose a Coupe or over to the Cabrio sub-forum to talk about why I prefer my Clubman or to the 1st Gen forum to regale the merits of a 2nd Gen?

Kinda see where I'm coming from here?

 

I think you are looking for a reason to be offended, to be honest.

The car fits fine in my garage. I was relaying that I did discover, though, that you have to have a little more room behind the clubman than you do a hatch if you wish to load/unload the boot. that's pretty much it.

I would think that since there are far more coupe owners on the forum than clubman owners, and that MANY people may have a coupe and are starting wonder if they are outgrowing it, that they might venture over here to see what the clubman owners think about their car.

Having been able to effectively take a really long test drive of a clubman, as a coupe owner, I thought I was in a position to give some opinion to the board. I feel I was objective and even handed, and tried to communicate my personal situation and not say that everyone would share my experiences.

Lastly, addressing the transmission and fuel economy situation:

at no time did I make any statement that I was some sort of superior driver. I am simply relaying what I've found over the last two weeks.

I readily admit that I haven't researched this for the R56 and variants, but on the first gen cars (and almost every other car made) the automatic transmission is rated at slightly worse fuel economy and slightly slower accelleration times. I won't get into a debate about the relative "performance" of the automatic vs. manual transmissions in MINIs as it relates to speed, as national-level SCCA results prove that out conclusively. It does seem to me that a Cooper clubman should still get equal to or better mileage than a cooper S coupe, given the 50 odd horsepower difference, so I am assuming that the reason it isn't is mostly because of the transmission, and slightly because of the additional weight of the clubman over the coupe.

that might be useful information to a person who is looking for the best possible fuel economy in their next purchase.

This forum used to be such a friendly place. I'm not sure that's the case any more, and one of the reasons why I don't post as much as I used to.

 

If that were true, then why do manual transmission equiped vehicles routinely get higher mpg ratings? Even MINI itself on its website indicates the manual transmission provides better gas mileage than the automatic.

If you got one as a loaner and wanted to share your impressions and how it worked out FOR YOU, no problem.

 

Sheeesh. I thought reviews and opinions were supposed to be varied and offer different perspectives? What's the point of only gushing about what we love about our cars, in threads dedicated to them in the first place?

I also don't think BSUCardinalfan was looking for a reception at all - warm or cold when he posted his review of the Clubman.

Xeraux - I'll just say it. From your first comment suggesting his garage was packed full of stuff to your last, you don't seem to have anything constructive to add, so why bother posting? **** off.

Does the hatch really offer more clearance than the Clubman doors? I can see a non-Clubman obviously having more room behind it in a garage (assuming the front is as far in as with the Clubman when parked), but if they have the same clearance at the back, does the hatch open / close without knocking you in the head?

I have a small detached 1 car garage. 12 x 20 feet. I have a Yamaha Vino scooter, a BMW motorcycle, various bicycles etc. in there along with the Clubman.

I had a Honda Civic hatch in there before, and am very happy with the few extra inches left over by the shorter Clubman. I leave lots of room at the front to walk around the car, but there's no room at all in the rear with the garage door closed. 2-3 inches to the bumper tops so I'm never loading my car inside the garage with the door closed, unless I back in.

If I could get away with a non-Clubman, I would, but I do like the extra leg/cargo space and I'm getting to prefer the stretched and squared off roofline of the Clubman.

 

I'd say that if the back bumpers were in the same place, the hatch and club doors take up about the same amount of room behind the car when open. The difference is that you can get under the hatch to load the boot, if you get what I'm saying. Say you have two armloads of stuff to load. With the hatch, I can pop the hatch, and the hatch ends up a few inches from the garage door. I can still load the boot. With the barn doors, if the barn doors are a few inches from the garage door, I can't get around them to load the car.

It seems obvious when you think about it, but I never made the connection until living with the car for a couple weeks. I do enjoy the additional room, though.

What kind of BMW motorcycle do you have? I'm a big fan of the F650 bikes, and I'd love to own one someday. I have a Suzuki SV650N now.

 

I dunno... The whole thing struck me as a bit of a troll...

"Hey Clubman owners, I don't like the Clubman, here's why, and the reasons I like my Coupe, better. Oh, and a couple of the reasons don't really have anything to do with the car, but more so with where I park it."

That sum it up?

I really like the barn doors. I've yet to bonk my head them like I've done with other hatchbacks. Is that more constructive?

I have a very modest two-car garage, as well. I've got two BMW bikes, one KTM, a Vespa, a lift, and my folding trailer, but I'm still able to open the doors and load my Clubman without opening the garage door. Is that more constructive?

Personally, I think the longer lines of the Clubman are more attractive than the Coupe. I haven't gone and posted that in Coupe Talk, though. Probably because it might be considered rude to drop that in the middle of the Coupe owner's sub-forum.

I think the chrome-ish "beltline" is a nice design feature which helps move the eye around the car. But I'm not dropping into a "blackout" thread to tell the people who are obviously enjoying doing that to their cars that I think a totally blacked out car looks silly.

You're right. It is a matter of perspective, and that's how I took his post.

 

I have an R52 S, R56 S Coupe, and an R55 Clubman...

Each drives differently for different reasons...I prefer the R56 S Coupe...but there ain't no way an "S" gets better gas mileage than just a plain Clubman...unless you park it for the winter...The R52 with the Super Charger gets the worst gas mileage...

R52...29/30 on the highway and 26 in the city.
R56...32/33 on the highway and 28 in the city.
R55...37-38 on the highway and 30 in the city.

 

Wow. I've been here for close to 7 years and almost 1000 posts, and now I'm a troll because I noticed something about the clubman that I hadn't noticed before, and thought I'd share it with people on a forum dedicated to MINIs.

You've been here about a month. Welcome to the forum.

I wouldn't expect you to research my posting history, but I will tell you that I've been a staunch defender of new models and iterations of the MINI. I'm far from any sort of purist.

That out of the way -

You were wrong about the transmission, you are mischaracterizing my posts here, and are alone in your self-righteous indignation. I have clarified and re-clarified my statements, but instead of admitting you were quick to jump to (incorrect) conclusions about my motives, you have chosen to stand firm in your belief that I somehow am here to get a rise out of people, most of whom I have never met in person. I feel that says a lot about your character, to be perfectly honest.

Now then, regarding the barn doors, if someone has a coupe and are used to parking it a certain way, the fact that they will have to modify that IS relevant to a review of the clubman from the perspective of a coupe owner, as I have done. Like most people, we have a 'system' in the garage where everything goes in it's place. Having the clubman upset my system just enough that I thought I'd point it out.

My post was a discussion solely of function, and I made no reference to style or form, as those are personal tastes, and my opinion matters little to anyone other than myself.

You are quite defensive about your choice of vehicle. I did not disparage or attack you or it in any way (well, until now, but to be honest, you just won't quit.)

This isn't a competition. This isn't a 'my car is better than your car' forum. We're all like minded people with similar interests, or we wouldn't be here in the first place. It is way more fun here when you aren't looking for reasons to be offended.

 

I'm getting 32/33 combined in my R56 S with a stick on my commute, which is 70% freeway/highway. That has been consistent over my 18 months of ownership. I will routinely get 36-37 on the highway on long trips.

In the same commute in the automatic clubman, I'm getting 29-30. I don't know if that is normal for an automatic clubman or not, but I've put two tanks in it and it's been pretty consistent. I was surprised enough that I thought maybe the tire pressures were low, but they aren't.

edit: Just checked MINIUSA.com. Cooper S is rated at 34/26 with manual. Cooper clubman automatic is rated at 33/25. My difference is greater than the published numbers, so either I'm driving the clubman harder (possibly, since it has less power and I'm used to a certain amount of accelleration) or this particular clubman just isn't quite running perfectly.

Still, I had always assumed that all versions of the cooper would be better regarding fuel economy than my car, so I've learned something new this week.

 

Personally, I don't like the R55 plain Clubman...but I do like the function of it...more room and the mpg.

 

I agree. For the record, My Clubman (manual,non-S) window sticker says 28city/37hwy. With my 1st tank of gas I am already averaging almost 32mpg and that is heavy city driving.

All that said, I live in NYC and find that at times the clubman barn doors and the clubman door are somewhat of a PITA. (do a you tube search for "clubman stupid doors" for video) Let me explain. Parking in tight parking lots means using the club door is out of the question especially if you have an infant. There simply isn't enough room to open BOTH the passenger door and the club door at the same time and get out unless you weasel out of what I call the "triangle of death" or you slam your body in the doors. I park next to a wall in my private parking spot. The same rules apply as above. I frequently have to parallel park in very tight spaces so the barn doors are useless in this situation where lifting a hatch may not be as was the case in my old car since the hatch door lifted up and above the front of the car parked behind me and not directly out into the front of the car parked behind me. HOWEVER, 90% of the time those things I mentioned above can be avoided or don't come into play. When they do come into play, then I have to say that BSU is correct and in his case he had to deal with these "door issues" 100% of the time because of his specific situation with the garage. So yes, it's not he MINI's fault BUT I also have to deal with the doors pretty much on a daily basis as well and I don't park in his garage. I park in a parking spot, in parking lots, and on streets like the rest of the world and I still experience some of what he said. What may not be an issue for some may be an issue for others and therefore the complaints or opinions about the doors are no less valid just because some or even most people haven't experienced the problems.

As for the extra space in the back of the clubman, I say ride 100+ miles in a Mini coupe and the extra 3 or so inches in a clubbie feel like 3 feet.

 

Thanks for the post BSU Cardinalfan. I enjoyed your personal observations and opinions.

I guess no one can say this is not a passionate bunch .

 

I think Xeraux is right, you would have had a better response with this in the Coupe Talk area.

 

Nice response. It's unfortunate to see the tone of some posts, inserting themselves to judge others opinions. I'm sure their perspective would be different if they had a critical or negative comment. I enjoyed reading BSU comments and his opinions were far from inflammatory. I personally like the 3rd door, but also agree it's not always convenient or easy. I think it really impacts those who have children who are in and out of the car frequently.

 

My kid gets out of all three MINIs with no problems.