Hi, all.

I'm generally familiar with Cold Air Intakes and the theory behind them. In most applications I've seen, the devices are mounted up front, behind the grill, where they take in fresh air that hasn't been heated by engine temps under the bonnet; hence the "cold" air intake. Many of them feature shrouding to block hot air from the engine bay.

The MINI's stock intake trunking also takes in fresh, unheated air through a duct right behind the grille before feeding it to the filter and then the turbocharger.

With that in mind, it seems that the CAI applications I've seen for the MINI place the inlet back behind the engine, just above the intake manifold. To me this seems really counterproductive, because while the design usually incorporates an efficient filter (read, K&N or similar), the unit is pulling in air from the back of the engine bay, and we know how hot that can get thanks to the engine and turbo in a confined space... this is the same heat that warps hood scoops.

So what's the deal with "cold" air intake installations that actually draw in hotter air than the factory setup? Wouldn't you be better off with the stock ducting and a lower-resistance filter?

(Note - I'm not referring to intercooler ducting, just the initial stage of the system.)

Thanks if you can explain! I'm not in the market to buy a CAI, I'm just curious about them, and where their advantage lies.

Cheers,

Spridget

 

You are exactly right! There are a couple of aftermarket cold air intakes that are actual cold air intakes. One gets intake air from the space just in front of the windshield, it works, but is noisy. There is another that has ducting from the hood scoop, it is pretty expensive. With both of these systems, the horse power increase is minimal and, I think, not worth the cost.

In my opinion the best option is a free flowing drop in air filter, in the stock cold air intake system, it'll cost less than $50 and is a real cold air intake.

Dave

 

Or the third option is a JCW Stage 1 CAI that uses a cone for a filter.

http://www.waymotorworks.com/jcw-int...6-r55-r57.html

Then you can change out the OEM paper cone for a high flow dry reusable from Detroit Tuned.

http://www.detroittuned.com/shop/?productID=424

And if you don't have one and prefer one, you can change out the air inlet pipe to a JCW.

http://www.waymotorworks.com/jcw-tur...5-r56-r57.html

 

Bingo! Most factory intakes are CAI's by design, and are highly engineered. Aftermarket intakes are generally good for 2 things - making more intake noise (which some people actually think is a good thing for some reason), and lightening your wallet.

Many years ago, a friend's dad walked into his garage, looked at the new high-rise aftermarket air cleaner setup he'd put on his Mopar sled, and commented "a smart fly could find his way in through that thing", then walked away. I think he yanked the thing immediately.

 

Spridget: I agree with your analysis. IMHO the JCW Stage I air filter is the setup that will maintain the stock cold air intake combined with an air filter with less restriction than the stock "flat panel filter" element. If you use the reusable type filter element, go light on the oil as to much tends to cause issues with the mass air flow sensing element. The thing I find curious is MINI doesn't use the Stage I type filter set up on the factory JCW...perhaps to save $ on the expensive filters during the "free" maintenance period.

 

Here's my take.

EVERY part of car design by a manufacturer is a compromise. In fact every part ever designed was a compromise.

For car makers, the engineers have to balance engine requirements, fitment, NOISE (one of the biggies), and cost. What usually gets left behind is performance.

Looking at all the options, I think the D.O.S. is probably the best solution.

 

I have bought 4 different air intakes for my R56, and the stock one is back on because it makes the most power.

PS, I have a great Carbon Dynamics Airbox for sales..... Its carbon fiber..... ooohh........No really I do...

 

My son has a DOS on his 09 Clubman, and it sounds cool, but I am not convinced it does anything besides sounding cool. In fact it sounds so cool with air rushing in and out and the BOV opening and closing that it actually gets kinda loud and obnoxious after a while, at least to me. I was going to jump in on the group buy, but decided there are better ways to improve driving performance for the same amount of money. That said, if I were to go with a CAI, I think the DOS is onto something with where they pick up the cold air. I think the JCW intake is also good, but as far as I am aware, it don't think it fits the 2011 MCS, however, I could be wrong on that one.

 

Thanks for the replies! It's not just me, then.

Cheers,

Spridget

 

Actually my K&N CAI on my R56 MCS did help with HP. It still uses the stock tubing from the grille to the airbox for COLD air. I ran a .1 second faster time in the 1/4 mile than the stock time from motor trend and im sure the average person cant run the same time as motor trend. so this proves my intake did increase HP. So don't knock on something til you have "actual" proof.

and it sounds good
thats my .02

 

Just curious, did you do that run with just the CAI mod and none of the other mods listed on your signature? I am glad you like your K&N CAI, and your seat of the pants experiment worked well.

Not wanting to start something, but unless you made a series of runs fully stock and then a similar series of runs in similar conditions and then compared times, or have run on a dyno with and without the K&N, I am not sure what we can say regarding the value of the CAI besides sight and sound. Most companies that sell CAI's have data graphs the supposedly show an increase in HP, but I am not sure how real that is and how much that translates to "on the road performance". I guess I am just a born skeptic.

 

My 14.065 was with my mods listed above. And that run stated above was with only the CAI. So I think it safely says it was an improvement.
And this talk sounds kind of aggressive but I promise it's not. Lol

 

Ok

 

Was it a series of runs that measured the same performance or was that the "best" single run you had. With that little bit of measured increase, maybe your off the line experience and skill got a little better which in effect resulted in this 1/4 mile time. Did YOU do a before and after? OR are You basing the 1/4 mile time off of motor trend? Seriously? Where was motor trends 1/4 mile clocked, what was the ambient temp outside? How many runs did it take for them to reach this time? Who was driving the car when they produced this time? You're not measuring apples to apple here.

The only way to measure the performance of a CAI is a Dyno to measure before and after with multiple pulls with and without the CAI. Butt Dynos and huge grins on your face don't mean much nor does a 1/4 mile time that you didn't put back to back with and without the CAI.

 

This discussion's sort of moot... 6speedwtneed clarified his installation with:
So my original theory still holds; his conversion is picking up cold air from the grille, and not hot air from behind the engine. If I was to do any kind of filter mod myself, that would probably be it.

And I agree with the posts above; any perceived improvement should be verified on the dyno if you're really serious about things like that.

Cheers,

Spridget

 

Yeah I never got to hit a dyne before and after... My dyno day is July 24th but that is with all my mods... =\

 

Has anyone actually measured the MAF temp vs ambient temp? I have a PLX Kiwi Wifi and have been doing testing with the MAF air temp vs the ambient temp. If ambient is below 70, the MAF is 1 degree above. If ambient is above 90, the MAF can be up to 10 degrees above. I have tested with the M7 Super AGS and AGS-R with heat shield with the same temp results.

On a side note, DashCommander is $30 off for a limited time.

 

My sarcasm meter is malfunctioning so I'm not sure if you were trying to be serious or not. I hope not as 0.1 seconds means nothing as far as the intake is concerned.

and don't praise something until you have proof either:

There have been plenty people who have proven on a dyno that the stock intake makes more power than most CAI's out there.

Now on the other hand if a noisy intake is all you are after the aftermarket filters will be just the ticket.

 

DoS uses the OEM cold air intake PLUS additional cold air from behind the firewall.

 

When you guys speak of the "stock intake", are you referring to the JCW intake that was listed earlier in the thread, or the stock air box setup on the R56 S? Just curious

 

No that doesnt prove anything, these cars are so different from car to car. The question is did you run faster than yourself with the stock box. I bet if you try again and do both, you will be suprised.

 

Terry Burger of Burger Motorsports did some testing of CAIs on intercooled turbo BMWs. He found no appreciable decrease of intake temps. He said you're better off using free flowing filters to give the turbo all the air it needs. Even if the filter is open and within the hot engine bay.