My turbo recently blew up and I have some questions about upgrading to the ATP GT28RS turbo kit...

-Would this turbo kit be ok on my R56 with stock internals?
-Is this turbo kit California Street Legal?

 

No. By the time this turbo finally spooled up and started getting into its efficiency zone your stock pistons would be ready to disintegrate. I wouldn't even consider it without forged internals and the uprated valve springs necessary to get to 7000 RPM. The stock ECU will also not control this turbo, so a separate dedicated boost controller is necessary. I'd recommend taking a look for OldBrokenWinds build list to get an idea of what's involved.

 

Even if I had the boost turned down? just until I get better internals?

 

It's still a difficult turbo to even physically fit in the engine bay. The few who have tried it in the past I believe had to spend a bunch of time with an angle grinder cutting out pieces of their hood to clear the turbo. It's going to be a difficult endeavor. If you're not prepared for that there are a bunch of smaller turbo upgrades like those from JM Turbo Coopers

 

Oh you could do it, no doubt. You'll need an Apexi AVC-R boost controller or similar to make it work, but you will have a very limited bottom end. If I remember correctly boost doesn't start really building till around 3500 rpm. If you want any kind of bottom end look at a GTX2860R with optional split turbine housing. This will necessitate a custom exhaust manifold as well to take advantage of the twin scroll housing.

I still wouldn't recommend it though without a strong bottom end, ported heads etc. The biggest issue with using one of these is finding a tuning solution. You can stuff an engine bay with the best hardware made, but without a tune to take advantage of it you've wasted your money.

 

Tigger is right. Dont waste your time. Your gonna have more headaches that you want. Even if you did have good internals. I got good internals, and i still didnt choose that thing. Look at the turbo map or charts. Much better options that work with less headaches and tuning options available.

 

Thanks for the feedback! I will decide what I am going to get within the next two weeks.

 

If your using a tuning company, like manic. Which is what i would suggest. He has tunes already set up for the owens turbo. I have the owens turbo. And its a really nice piece. It'll supply more than enough air to do what you need for these motors. Theres a guy that has ALOT of experience with that tune and the turbo. I'd highly suggest using him.

 

How much is a stock turbo replacement?

 

Check these guys out for a nice stock replacement

 

bait and switch , he does not have oem turbos all chinese. you call for borg warner and get a reman with chinese parts inside.. buyautoparts.com is borg warner dealer and can get you real borgwarner turbos

http://www.turbos.bwauto.com/afterma...torSearch.aspx will give you list of all real borgwarner suppliers

 

I've got a turbo that is the equivalent to a JCW turbo I'd like to get rid of.

 

Do i need a new ECU if i want to get the GT28RS?

 

No the MED17.2 DME for the N14 is a great little ECU. Motec does sell an M1 kit for the N14 but it costs a kindney....and maybe a lung as well. Your least expensive, best option is the dedicated boost controller I mentioned with a resistor installed where the old boost controller connected, That way the ECU thinks its still controlling the boost, then everything else will remain under control of the ECU. Then you match the boost curve in the boost controller to what the tune is expecting so as to avoid any boost deviation errors. Without being able to see the boost map in WinOLS there will be a bit of rial and error to dial it in. Like I said, it can be done but you have to have the time or money to throw at it. With a forged bottom end to take advantage, it might make sense. Otherwise I'd suggest ditching the idea for now and get your turbo overhauled for $350 -$550 at G-Pop shop while you put together your build list for the engine.

 

Or buy my gpop turbo i only put about 300 miles on.

 

I have about 3-4k to spend

 

Mine is only 600 of it. Leaves ya lots a room for lots a goodies.
Just kiddin

 

You might need twice as much and a lot of downtime

mQubed Motorsport, Manic Tuning Dealer

 

As mentioned earlier, here's a link to my thread where my build experience is documented. No pics but lotsa details --- https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...a-stuff-2.html

I ran with the early version of this turbo kit, plus other mods, for about 3 years on stock internals. It was dyno tuned at 20PSI boost for 282WHP. HOWEVER, I seldom run full boost.

There's little to no possibility of this kit being street legal in CA! Originally, ATP had a "disclaimer" that in CA this kit was for "off-road" purposes only.
-It uses a 3" catless downpipe
-It uses an external bypass / blow-off valve
-The wastegate has to be controlled manually
-There is absolutely no ECU control for this turbo

Also, the boost curve is far enough away from OEM to cause limp-mode CEL's --- mostly P2885 & P2884, anytime boost is used. Yes, you can learn to work around this mismatch, but you also need a way to reset the CEL "on the fly" or you spend a lot of time "limping".

Then there's the matter of making it fit under the hood. Check out my "Garage" for a pic under my hood --- 2 extra "holes" in the structure. You also lose the heat shield unless you fab a custom version. I've already melted a valve cover and the rubber "grommet" over the radiator.

You also need new air inlet hoses to fit the 3" turbo air inlet. Then adapt the PCV hose and fitting to this new inlet hose system. Don't forget the bypass / blow-off valve hose connection, unless you choose to run with it dumping to atmosphere, which is NOT recommended.

If you don't do the labor yourself, the cost will eat the rest of your budget.

Then, if you get this far, you NEED a tune. Mine was done by Jeff Perrin 4 years ago when the AccessPort was popular. I'm told he no longer does AP tunes, and
I only know of one other AP tuner in the country. There are other choices BUT I'm also told by one of the best that to match the Garrett curves with the ECU, the tuner needs to access parts of the ECU that are NOT accessible --- a "stand-alone" ECU is needed. He also recommends Borg-Warner for higher boost capability.

If you're still not convinced this is a bad idea, I strongly suggest you find a tuner with Mini experience, then work with him BEFORE going with a Garrett. Yes, I've made mine work, and it's awesome to say the least. It also took one hell of a lot more than your $4K budget, and 4 years of patience, frustration and TLC. It should also be known that two of the best tuners in the business won't touch mine --- it's too far out! I'm still looking tho ---

 

What is the nicest Hybrid Turbo available for the R56?

 

OWENS TURBO. Its already been worked out on the dyno with manic. Gotta go with what works.
Im getting a funny feeling that theres been some damaged engines lately. If people are getting over boost situations. And the S and JCW sensors only go so high, and these other turbos are seeing values above what these sensors are calibrated for. That would tell me they could be lean. If they only go so high and it over boosts, where the extra fuel gonna come from ? Wait !! Or not coming from ? I still got a GPOP turbo for sale with only a couple hundred miles on it. The compressor wheel is the same size as the JCW turbo. 600 bucks takes.

 

Good question about the "extra fuel" This is one reason I continue to emphasize getting a good tune, especially when boost limits are exceeded. In my case, I had a remote AP tune with extensive data logging. I trust this is what's keeping my engine in one piece. My AFR is slightly low, in one tuners opinion, but he wasn't overly concerned. However, he's the one that won't get involved with defeated MAP sensors. I'm obviously not the only one he's dealt with over boosting.

Your GPOP turbo shouldn't cause any issues with AFR but whoever buys it should still get tuned for the difference --- good insurance!

 

Which Owens turbo for my car?

 

I will get you the exact p/n when i get home. In the mean time i'll go to there website and see if i can find it.

 

Heres a snapshot of the turbo tigger had talked about. Its the same turbo i have now that i look at the specs.