Long story short (to open up with)

few years ago i had mario flash me the RPM Stage 3.
JCW Turbo installed
intercooler
catless downpipe
stock exhaust with resonator delete and replaced with a bullet resonator that really gives it a nice sound

But the tune has never been right from the minute i turned the car on and i told mario within a couple of days something wasnt right.
from 650rpm idle when he claims its set to 750-800rpm (its never idled there since the ecu came back) and as far as i am concerned its a bad tune.
mario didnt blame the car but didnt offer to relash the ECU and said its gotta be the engine. So essentially it was my problem and that really pissed me off.

3 times into the shop it went all with inspection and exploration in mind.

At 120k miles they said it was probably the cleanest inside of the engine they had seen

Smoke test passed
fuel, air, vacuum, etc all came back fine.
they said the only thing they found was that there was a 2 point difference on the intake pressure than external. They said it was something to note but nothing they think would ever cause what i was seeing happen.

And never once has the engine thrown a code, and i dont get it.

what is “not right”?

By not right i meam every single day i get in the car its “tuned performance” is different.
Most when cold it runs tight and mostly good, but there are times i start it and its loose and poopy.
Never once have i ever felt like this was a stage 3 tune, stage 2 i suppose maybe but never 3.

But 100% when it warms up or i drive around for ½ hour or so it just starts getting sloppy and poopy.

im not getting any codes, for the most part i am usually hitting the 20-22lbs boost but even at full boost its like the car is not turned its just like before i got it tuned when i had the JCW Turbo put on, its just boost without any reaction to the boost.

once i drive it for said ½-1 hr if i shut the car off for about 15-30 min if the car was running good performance/tune wise i can guarantee that when i start it back up it just tuns like the tune isnt there.

and that maybe is the best way to describe it, sure its making boost but all my issues stem from the entire system acting like the tune isnt there.

im kinda fed up with it because i have never seen a car do this and it 100% didnt do this prior to the tune so i know that is where its coming from but i dont discount a part or something, i just dont know what the hell could do this.
The vanos sensors?? (Mine are not 10mm bolts they are a torx head and someone jacked up the torx head on the exhaust vanos so i cant even get it out.
the intake vanos i have had off and cleaned which disnt help.
so i am happy to replace them but i am not aware that a vanos sensor can cause a tune to act like its not even there.

i dont know i love my mini but im about done and ready to sell it. But i dont want to.

But hiw can such drastic changes to performance (tune there then seemingly or partially not when warned up or if i restart the car after making a stop the tune is all poop, how can it not be throwing codes.

confused big time and not sure what to look at.

on a funny side note - in my replacing of parts i purchased a new MAF sensor that claimed to be for the mini but was wire based not film based like the mini uses, and it caused the engine to dump a ton of extra fuel and holy mother of god that engine ran harder faster and tighter than i had ever seen but unfortunately that extra fuel was too much and caused sulfur smell in the exhaust like very pronounced odor so i replaced with a real mini one and it went back to running fine then loose then fine then lose.

 

I hate to say it, but the problem is Mario doesn’t do the tuning, he only loads “off-the-shelf” tunes produced by RPM Power, and that’s why the tune doesn’t act right. Something in the tune isn’t configured correctly for your specific car. I would get in touch with @Lou@Prototype-R to see if he can offer a complementary data log to see what’s going on? I went from a Manic stage 2 to Lou’s stage 2, and the performance difference was night and day. The car runs soooo much better with a custom calibration.

 

oh i know marios role is to load a canned tune i 100% dont argue that but my car your car its all the same (thats not true but you know what i mean).
living in iowa temps, humity, barometric pressure can vary wildly and i 100% accept that.
but we are talking massive changes from day to day and even hour to hour.
The weather doesn't change that much lol.
Being when its warmed up when it doesnt run as good that tells me something, gotta be a leak but i dont know and have no way of finding out outside of maybe another smoke and pressure/vacuum test once its warmed up.

and i also agree each car is different in that the canned tune may or may not work perfectly, and a true dyno tune is the real way to get it right, unfortunately no one in Iowa that i know of does this so im kinda screwed .

But i will reach out to this gentleman and talk to him and see what we can make happen.

i love my car it hasnt given me a lick of trouble and i want to keep that going but its really wearing on me what has happened since day one.

 

I had similar problems with the JB box and since upgraded to the NM module. Even still not hitting target boost. I agree a datalog can help determine what the cause is. On WOT what is your AFR? it should be around 12. I am not sure if the JCW and the S share the same fueling system and your boost levels are much higher with the new turbo. When I went to stage 2 on my WRX it smelled like eggs everywhere I went. Thats part of not having a cat.

You never said anything about a compression check. I had a 2009 and 2011 that both had failures in piston 4 and needed to be rebuilt around 60k. I'd be surprised if you have good compression all around at 125k.

 

i dont recall if they did compression i would have to call and ask.

not having a cat doesnt make your exhaust smell like that not that i have experienced, though i have heard that statement before.
a bad one can if its throwing off O2 sensors along with a bad coil pack (went through that with my accord along with it being totally fowled out and only running on 5 of 6 cylinders.)

the bad smell only ever happens if i install the wire / bare resistor based MAF. ( atleast previously, today i cant tell if it was me or someone else and it wasnt very strong.

I just put it in the wire based MAF and reset adaptations and she was running real aggressive like i would expect a stage 3 to but i thought i smelled a slight eggy smell a couple of times but a big uhaul was behind me at the stop lights and i couldnt tell if it was just rich exhaust from me or another car, it was not as over powering like prior when the MAF was installed (last summer), which i did not reset adaptations last time. Today i did.

that model of MAF also seems to cause a dead zone at the start of the throttle that went away when i replaced it with the proper Bausch model. Along with any remnants of stinky exhaust.

A/F command ratio was usually 1.0 but would jump to over 2.0 under boost or high rpm when not into the throttle (high rpm and let off the throttle)

MAP, not MAF, is showing 13.34 at idle and will go up to 36 psi when in full boost.
boost is 20-22 psi.

i dont know why but i am not getting a reading for MAF and for some crazy reason it just shows 0.00 in my UltraGuage, and i cant find the live readings for all the sensors in the Schwabben tool.
pretty sure i have seen MAF report somewhere but with my UltraGuage it doesnt work. Which seems pretty crazy

 

actually, egg smell is the sulfer by product in fuel not being fully burnt. The smell is an indicator of either running rich or a faulty cat. In your case your ecu probably didn't get a correct reading and dumped a ton of fuel and you don't have a cat.. Maybe its fueling issue because your car ran "tighter" with the extra fuel?

my afr hovers around 14.8 and the richest it goes on WOT is about 11.8 on my car. You really don't want it to be too lean at WOT especially with a lot of boost. If your hitting 36 lbs of boost you may be running out of fuel and thats why your so lean. I am not sure if your hitting 13.34 at your target boost of 22 but that seems a bit lean. From what I have heard 22 boost is getting close to its limits without some supporting mods and fuel system would be a good start.

I would look into your fuel trims and actual AFR as read by the o2 sensors. Also look into timing. Something may be causing it to retard. If your experiencing most of your drivability problems while putting around town and your engine is in good shape that might be the issue.

 

In the RPM tune the lower O2 is deleted so you only get the O2 from the turbo down pipe.
i was playing with watching short and long fuel trim but i have forgotten where the tune says they should be.


MAP - manifold air pressure - the air pressure at the air intake manifold right before it enters the engine intake valve.
on a naturally aspirated engine map doesn't exceed atmospheric pressure, usually 14.7 psi or 1 bar at sea level.
In a turbo, MAP is 2-3 times or more, atmospheric because the turbo is forcing air into it.
At idle or warm the mini reads near 14psi on the MAP. (Or under no boost)
winter or mild cool temps the mini goes into negative boost to account for atmospheric maf and map to allow it to run.

so if i were to say local iowa air pressure was 1 bar, and i add 20lbs of boost that easily gives me the 35 psi MAP
At idle i should be at that 1 bar 14.7 MAP, or 0 on my boost gauge, or at cold start the mini goes into a negative boost state to help the engine run.

a boost guage top dead center is 0 or 14.7 psi but a MAP reports it in its native form. So boost reads 0 and map reads 14.7

so…. 14.7 map + 22psi/lb boost = 36 psi MAP reading.

this is normal and how the map reads its.

but if your MAF is bad and not reading intake air mass then you will run too rich or too lean.

im prolly gunna have to hook up something like the Torque app and try to read MAF.

the Map (air intake pressure at the manifold ) and Maf (air intake mass at the air intake(filter) ) work together with the ecu to manage air to fuel ratio.

 

AFR is read by the O2 sensors post cat, or where they were before removing them. Those readings are not dependent on boost rather the ratio between air and gas post engine... What's your exhaust setup like? Do you have the o2 sensors connected? Do you have bungs to remove cels?

The way the ecu targets different squares on the curve is by referencing values on temp, air volume, barometric, altitude ect then applies a target. AFR targets are based on the gases out the rear of the exhaust. What is the full fuel duty cycle reading on your injectors?

I don't see why your so lean on AFR. Also afr shouldn't be below (or in this case richer than 11 afr) unless you downloaded the latest flamethrower mod.

 

The biggest problem with canned tunes like this are all engines run slightly different, and you have no idea what was tuned and what wasn't, or what might be turned off. Going stage 3 is a big risk with a canned tune due to the bigger turbo, and this isn't the first time I've heard stories of Mario blaming the car or hardware.

Do you still have the second cat in the exhaust? Or did your "resonator" delete get rid of it? If you have no cats at all, a sulfur smell wouldn't be out of the question.

Also, some tuners will turn off the MAF sensor. Since it isn't used on European Minis, they think they can recalibrate the USA engines to run the same. Perhaps this is how your RPM tune was configured...

 

A/F monitoring is performed by the first sensor, right after the turbo. The second sensor is there to monitor cat efficiency only.

 

yup and i have thE Lowe O2 plugged off.
Mario deletes it in the RPM Tune

spoke with Lou over at prototype-r and the ball is rolling for getting the stage 3 possibly, its about 20-25 hp/tq less than Rpm but if its programmed better it may actually run better

i am currently interested in why my MAF is reporting 0.00, gunna try dash command and see if it reads it if not then swapping it with a different one. If the ecu isn’t reporting a maf reading then it just defaults to what ever is in the ecu, right or wrong.

 

I dont believe that with a custom tune by Lou you will be -20/25hp BUT....if that happens means that, your car was NEVER ready for that extra 20/25. trust this guy!! If there is a guy that really knows about this ECUs..ITS LOU.

 

his stage 3 is lower by 20-25hp than RPM’s Stage 3
I'm makin hp/tq i can more or less butt dyno it but its just all over that place and feels real sloppy sometimes.
today was a prime example, last couple days were fine but today i fired it up and it wasnt the same.

but i have no one around me that can actually tune a mini so if Lou can remote in and do some monitoring and tuning with his tune then …:/

 

I have nothing of real value to input, but I am following and curious on the outcome of your new tune. I currently have a Manic Stage 1 tune and am wanting to go to Lou for a stage 2. I am not happy or impressed with the Manic. I reached out to Mario and Lou (per njaremka recommendation everywhere), and Lou definitely took my business due to his customer service and how he took the time to go over my needs. It will be another month before I get it, but I am excited for it and can't wait to hear your outcome of it

 

You won’t regret going with Lou. He is passionate and knowledgeable about these cars. Mario has passion, too, but it’s more directed on the sales side of things. I did have conversations with him before my clutch job, and I almost went with a package from him due to his talk. Glad I held out and did more research…

 

Hi Cyberlunacy,
I would recommend checking the connections to the MAF sensor and possibly try a different data logger just to make sure you don't have a mechanical issue. If everything is mechanically and electrically sound but you still get no MAF reading then you probably have a MAFless tune. This is what is known as a VE or Speed Density tune. This type of tune assumes a given air mass (g/s) is entering the engine based on the manifold pressure, rpm and air temperature. This extrapolated air mass is then used to determine fueling, load, timing, etc. This style of tune can certainly make good power but tends to suffer more driveability issues, especially at part throttle. In addition, changes made to the vehicle that effect airflow can push those assumptions even further from the actual amount of air entering the engine. All of our tunes from Stage 1 to Stage X work with the MAF sensor and report correctly with DashCommand, Carly and Bimmerlink as well as the Stage X Data Logger we provide during the tuning process. Are you still leaning towards switching from 93 octane to 91?

 

i def did not request a maf less tune in fact mario and i talked out it in that it would not be a good idea because its not a track car and i deal with alot if varying temps and weather in iowa, its my 24/7 driver so a static maf woulf be bad but to be totally honest if i were a guessing man, that would be one of my guesses given how bloody different the car runs every time i start it and those short trips to the store when i come out and start it up it just runs all poopy , again making boost but its like its not tuned to take advantage of it.

 

One thing to note and i need to do another test is that with the stock air box, and i think it was a Mann filter (which has fantastic air flow) i think it runs better but i need to swap out the CIA with it and test again.
it was tuned for a CIA but without knowing exactly the air mass/flow of the specific filter and logging it in my car, any static MAF tune would be pointless and probably wrong.

using the ultra guage for the mini it claims 260-270 torque and 250-260 hp but that is not WHP that is just math from the ECU readings but it gives me something to start with.

 

I'm running down the avenue of Lou as well and have already spoken with him and purchased the stage 2. I'm just waiting on the cable to come in the mail before we can get started. I'm in almost the exact same boat as you. I purchased an RPM Stage 2 (not from Mario, but you an do the math). My engine is impeccable and in great condition, but was told by the installer that it "must be an issue with the engine as these tunes bring out any problem and amplify it." I bought it and replaced about $1500 in parts that probably didn't need to be replaced. I get the same boost surging, but it's not consistent. As I read this thread the idea of a MAF-less tune is making sense to me and would explain what we are both seeing.

I wouldn't sweat the horsepower number differences as they are just numbers. The question, in my mind, is how well does the horsepower provided put power to the wheels and how well does the car drive. There is a good chance that you probably wouldn't have hit those claimed Stage 3 numbers anyway.

I'm looking forward to working with Lou once I get the cable and getting this sorted out. Good luck to you as well!

 

Well, I have been working with Lou @ Prototype-R for the last week and after a few logs and tunes I think I'm all dialed in and couldn't be happier. No more boost surge at all! I'll be writing another full review when I have some time.

 

thanks for the feedback.
right now work has me super busy and a business trip first of the month too so i dont know exactly when i will get it done but i am.

i also confirmed from some other tunes that RPM/mario does a MAF-less tune which is more than likely why i have had such varying results.
you cant do a maf less tune with out having the ability to constantly return it and if the air intake doesnt match the dummy setting they use then you are pulling more or less air than needed and is gunna screw you up

 

So tune came back from mario and its super aggressive, way different than the first tune ever was.
Low end hits way harder, maybe the way it should have all along, i have nothing to compare it too.

If i didn't know any better i would say its nothing more than a throttle adjustment, but i don't know.
Throttle position adjustments should never be implemented, ok sport mode if you want but non sport that stupid throttle should be linear and true to where you foot is.
TPS #2 (which is throttle position something something brakes - like in relation to the brakes ??) reports a super high throttle position based on where your foot is, say 80% at 1/2 throttle.
TPS 1 reports accurately.
(most sites call it TPS A and B,)

It still runs different once the engine is warmed up and then you shut it off and turn it back on its just not as bad as prior but it 100% is still there any noticeable. (doggy, not as 'tuned' as when started cold)
I could 100% see the VANOS doing this, the intake vanos i can take off and will replace but the exhaust vanos, the torx heat is warped (the torx teeth) from some previous owner and i cant use a torx bit to take it out. Not sure how to remove a torx when they are like that except a reverse thread bolt remover except i fear greatly breaking the head off.

Engine gets up to temp runs good until you shut it off, turn it back on.

Engine lopes at idle too when you restart it and runs maybe 75-100 rpm lower, it should never drop below what 750 ?, which the original tune did too but it faded over time, but periodically would pop up once in a while.

 

Your tune sounds exactly like mine to be honest. After I replaced the timing chain, cleaned valves and all that. My startup warm is a lot different than cold. And mine has always done that lope that you are describing. I am receiving the tuner from Lou on Wednesday and it couldn't get here sooner. I am so over this tune and looking forward to what Lou is going to be able to do. I don't care about horsepower numbers if I am able to put it to the ground more effectively.

That vanos bolt was stripped on mine too. I extracted it. It isn't in there super tight so there's no chance of being afraid of the head. That bolt is also pretty soft, so it's not tough to drill the initial hole into it. Took me about 10 minutes to do. Although, it was a lot easier with the intake manifold removed too. Hope this helps!

 

but its so friggin tight in there lol. (not nearly as tight as other things that one could replace for sure)
good to know.
I know the intake one came out pretty easy, and cleaned it off though it looked fine, i was even going to take a flat head screwdriver and grind it to fit in the star points and just use that to extra the bolt but we'll see.

The shop i take the car to doesn't do any walnut blasting and i am not comfy in doing it myself + rotating the engine so that each valve is closed.
Just not my bag.
Seen all sort of "fantastic" additives but i just don't feel ok doing that, plus the N18 shouldn't need blasted but there isn't anything stopping it from getting carboned up since it has 125k on the engine.

 

Just a heads up for what it's worth. I'm not saying that walnut blasting is a waste of time as we all know these DI engines have issues, but my N18 has 105K on it and running Lou's tune I don't have any of the issues I had before with the RPM. I was chasing all the things I was told were "my fault" or the "car's issues" and I just didn't have any issues. Getting Lou's tune kind proved that to me. I can't tell you how much money and time I dumped into the car thinking something was wrong with it because of that damn RPM tune (close to $1500 after the cost of the tune and three full weekends...ok I guess i can tell you). It's easy to hand someone $800 and if it doesn't work it's also easy for the tuner to point to a number of issues that this platform may or not have. I'm not bitter hahaha

All being said, Lou wouldn't stop contacting me until I was 100% happy with what the car was doing. Just not the type of guy he is. Hell, I spent a full week and about 8 logs back and forth before I was happy with the pop and burble of all things. He wanted 100% satisfaction from me.