Although I'm not huge fan of Peugeot/Citroen the engine is really intreguing because of the direct injection.. I've seen some gawdy numbers on Diesels with direct injection with basic mods.. I'm talking 600 to 700lbs of torque with a different chip and an exhaust and still going about 25 mpg.. I've heard big F250's smoking Vipers in the quarters.. thats sick .. so I'm hoping that the direct injection petrol engines will be somewhat tunable like that.. I think the most intriguing engine out right now is the duel injection that lexus has direct and indirect.. thats pretty sick.

 

Gabe was saying this is a BMW engine with cooperation from Peugeot/Citroen in building it so I don't feel as bad about looking to wait for the 2007 and deal with whatever bugs that come up with new model. I think the benefits of the Turbo vs the Super will outway the problems that will be encountered. Besides who can tell me that the problems, if any, that were encountered with the 2002 were not fixed to the satisfaction of the customers, facts???

I trust Mini and BMW to back their products a little more then let the consumers down by not supporting any fixes that could need to be made for this new intro model in 2007. I have not purchased products from BMW or Mini yet but if anyone can tell me if they have had major problems that were not overcome quickly by their dealership please do. I'm sure that Mini will have to rename the new turob version MCT too.

 

See https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ad.php?t=54011

Your only seeing a VERY small sample and many people complaining the problems were never fixed to their satisfaction, not to mention the aggravation ... nothing appeard MOD related but normal car stuff

 

FWIW, word on the streets is that the new engine is having issues. It is blowing head gaskets at stock boost . I hope they get THAT fixed .

 

Sorry Guys, I'll take a Brazilian Chrysler over anything made in France. Vehicle components having anything to do with a country that spawns engineers capable of designing automotive wheels with 3 lug nuts have to be shunned at all cost. There's a reason why so many cars are being torched on the streets of Paris -- they're no d---ed good!
Name me one French car that any man woman or child in the civilized world has ever dreamed of owning (no, France is not included in that part of the world).

Except for the true-to-its-heritage Lucas-like electrical problems, I'm happy with my '02. I'll just have to wait 'til the the 3rd generation engines (maybe a Russian Svoda) come out before I replace it.

 

Wow... The French have some bullet proof diesel engines that many of the european makes are interested in. I spend a good deal of time in Switzerland for work and Peugeot, Renault and Citroen cars are pretty common to see and are popular. Peugeot makes some pretty nice cars that are fun to drive (i've rented a few and have some coworkers who own them). Hell, this year the French had the hot ride in F1! Just because they aren't popular here doesn't mean they aren't nice cars!

 

I hope we're not seriously contemplating a diesel engine for high-performance vehicle. When I'm ready to start delivering French bakery goods for a living, I'll consider a Peugot diesel powered MINI.

 

BMW 330d > *

 

Shut my mouth! I stand corrected!

 

while its true that the french have been slacking where it comes to build quality, i think we can't forget the citroen ds.. that thing has tech from the 50's that still aren't on many cars today and are on only reallly expensive luxury cars. as for the three lug nuts well i guess its how you place them.. look at the F1 cars only One huge bolt in the center. Seems to work for them.. As for the engine having problems, thats why peugeot/citroen get to be the guinea pigs.. once it gets to the mini it will be much better. I haven't seen a bmw engine that wasn't good in the last 10 years. PLus, they probably be using a variant of the engine as an entry level engine for the new 1 series so they will have to make it somewhat reliable.

As for the performance diesel, well it won't rev to the moon but with the right tranny gearing it will kick some booty.. And don't forget they are thinking of a AWD mini. so that might just be one more incentive/detraction to look at the new one. Personally, I don't think the Mini needs to be AWD.. i think its pretty neutral in the bendies, but I'm not going argue if they so choose to.. The only problem i have with the awd is the weight issue.. the x-drive system isn't exactly a lightweight. Or they can do what renault did with the v-6 clio.. Mid-mount the engine and make it a rear-wheel driver haha.. i think not.

 

I heard from a lil birdie that they will be shutting down the plant sometime in July-Aug to rebuild it around the new design plus stock it with the parts they need for the builds.

I think around mid next year you will start seeing projected pricing on what it should be selling for. We wont know until Aug i think a rep said to a salesmen here.

 

I 2nd that.......its not a twin turbo....but a twin scroll system

 

Yep, that's what I meant...Fingers work faster than my brain sometime.

 

Hmmm... the French are certainly capable of building a durable small displacement high ouput turbo engine. WRC proves that. OTOH, I opted to get the '06. Its a bit of a gamble, never the less, this is my street car, not my track car, so I'm more interested in on road performance, which means I'd place a premium on making power down low, not up high. One senses the makings of contraversy here reminiscent of that which was experienced in the Porsche world when they went from air to water cooling. Who knows, maybe an '06 MCS will be made more desirable as the last of the superchargers. My take is its a great now, perhaps it will be better later, but why wait if you're in the market today?

 

Thats definitely a good way to look at it..especially because the new 07's will probably have problems with it because of it being a first production run. and plus what is there to improve on the mini really.. i can see engine needing a bit more power.. but thats really about it.. especially for a daily driver and not a track car. Tell you the truth i much prefer the supercharger because its more useful for daily driving than the turbo.. CANT stand turbo lag.. it makes me car sick. so unless the new one doesn't have a large turbo lag i'll be sticking with the supercharged ones

 

I'm leaning more in this direction now too. I haven't ordered my Mini yet but will probably look at getting into a 06 and relook the new Mini with turbo in 08 or 09. If everything goes well I'll probably end up with one of each, super and turbo MCS.

I'm in the market now and going with proven technology and performance vice bleeding edge, I've bled too much for things like this already, will reduce some headaches for now with this decision 06 verse 07.

Thanks,

Scott

 

I am not going to speculate on the merits of the MCS vs. MCT engine, but I will say that I believe a good deal of the engine switch (other than technilogical) could be that of having a DaimlerChrylser engine in a BMW owned product.

I plan on ordering a 06 model simply because I like the look and performance of it. The idea of a longer, wider and taller Mini kind of defeats it's mission to me. I have also read that Mini plans on decontenting the new Mini to increase profit.

2 cents, thats all it's worth

 

MCS'02, 50k.mi+, blower equipped and no problems.
I expect to get another 50k.mi. out of it. I'd have
gone with the 15% pulley but AutoX- G Stock ( no engine mod.s).
Yes, the turbo uses waste energy, free(?) exhaust, but I'm still not
convinced of long term reliability from turbos in street
cars. Lots of heat under the hood, lots of oil during changes.
Don't ever miss a change date. Even then wear is a problem.
I don't know what service will cost on turbo bearing
replacement but I'll bet it's worse than blower service.
The lack of room under the bonnet will heat up the intercooler
rendering it less effective. Although I went for the first year
MCS, if I were buying now I think I'd go 2006.

 

I feel you on being a new model that will have its problems , but with the direct port injection and the twin scroll turbo there shouldnt be any turbo lag. As for power, with the above said, you can turn the boost up on this engine and make pleanty of power with out hurting anything i think.

Trust me....When we get our first car in stock, im sure we will start breakin it down and seeing what it possible to do with them.

 

There are credible rumors of blown head gaskets at stock boost. We'll see.

 

I would rather give up some HP then to switch to a Turbo. I have owned several Turbo cars in the past. The Lag drives me nuts. I like power when I want it, not whenever the motor gets around to it. I think the SC is much more durable then the Turbo. Mercedes is using the same roots type supercharger. Also the ford cobra and the lightning trucks also. I have never heard of people complaining about the superchargers.

I think if they made the new motors a 2.0 with larger supercharger that would be awesome
Just my opinion.

 

First off I've spoken with people directly involved in the development of this drivetrain and according to them, things are going smoothly. No idea where you heard these "rumors" but they don't jive with the first hand accounts I've heard. Secondly it would be highly unlikely that they would be having issues at this stage considering Peugeot is already producing their version of the engine for cars that are being sold now in Europe.

And finally for all those that some how keep missing the key words "no turbo lag" - this engine will feature a BMW designed twin scroll turbo and will have essentially no turbo lag whatsoever. I've talked with a few folks who have driven prototypes and they can't say enough good things about the power band and eagerness to rev. Not once have they mentioned anything about lag.

 

Many of today's smaller turbos can develop peak torque from very low down the RPM range and maintian a decent % of it all the way to redline. I doubt turbo lag will be a problem.

 

okay okay okay... lets set some things straight other than most of you not knowing very much about turbos...
Yes... expect to see turbo lag... that will be more than made up for in top end power as opposed to a supercharger that gives great low end power and response but begins to peeter out as you rev the car higher...(think 19% pulley)

in regards to turbos being cheaper as a solution to improve the bottom line (profit)... thats a total crock... think about it... they came up with so much more technology to counter act the side effects of the turbo and turbo lag that it is no longer cost effective... think about it... they now have VANOS... and have developed twin scroll turbocharging... coupled with direct injection... NONE of those things are cheap or easy to develop. However if a turbo charger does fail it will be much less costly than replacing the supercharger on a MINI considering that rebuilt superchargers from the dealer go $2500 and a new one runs $3200 bucks... a WET DREAM ball bearing turbo from garret will run ya about 1200 bucks... i would tip my hat in the direction of the turbo for this one...

Secondly... You must all remember that BMW still is the one who approves the engine... someone else is just building the engine. BMW has final approval on the whole matter. Also, bmw is no stranger to turbos... They arguably build the best turbo diesl cars in the world...

As far as the talk of MINI makng more profit on these cars... YOU ARE CORRECT the platform will be much more usable this time around. THe new platform will beable to sustan more models therefore reducing the overall cost of the platform. They will beable to spread the costs out over many differnet models as opposed to a handful... THIS is most likely the way that the are "reducing" costs.

BMW is one of the most profitable car companies in the world and one of the last independantly owned automakers... they know what they are doing and will not allow the MINI brand to fail.

and as far as owning a french car... ever heard of a Renault Clio with a mid mounted v6? ITs a pretty insane hatchback and i would gladly take that car over a MINI any day of the week... the power goes to the rear wheels...

 

agreed with Gabe, and for the record, Peugeot cars have been highly known with their long lasting state of art motors. I can not say the same for the workmanship and wuality of the rest, but especially after 90s, Peugeot stepped up to the plate. Especially their diesel and turbo diesel motors are bullet proof. Do not judge Peugeots with a little knowledge.