WELL SAID.

 

I agree, there is a lot to be sad about. But, I otherwise disagree.

Criticizing the R56 is absolutely fine ...but have a little tact guys. Some have called the R56 grotesque. Doesn't that sound a tad inflammatory to you? Of course a statement like that will be met with fierce resistance. How about simply saying you don't like a certain aspect of the car, rather than calling it hideous, constipated, insipid or bulbous.

C4, you and all the other R56 detractors are absolutely, positively entitled to your views and I, for one, want to hear them ...just try to be gentlemen and a bit more civil when you express them.

Also, keep in mind that we, the enthusiasts, have never been BMWs customer base. We are the minority of MINI owners and they are now catering to the majority of MINI owners. Remember, they took the burble out of the car because of rampant complaints from US owners. Do you for one minute think that anyone on NAM complained about the burble? Of course not.

I'm willing to bet the R56 will far outsell all of its predecessors and who can fault BMW for wanting to do that? And what are the enthusiasts to do? How about simply change what you don't like. Its not like every R53 ran around in stock form ...guys modded the crap out of them to turn them into a car they liked better. Just as the R56 is not perfect, neither was the R53.

Lastly, please don't label all of us R56 guys as intolerant of opinions that differ from yours. Actually, you shouldn't even label all of us R56 guys ...I'm a MINI guy ...I love them all and would have happily bought an R53 if they still made them. I welcome all opinions, I just find the condescending manner in which they are often expressed to be very annoying and harmful to the community spirit.

So, consider sticking around, rather than leaving. Don't change your opinions, just change the way you express them.

dean.

 

Well said, gentlemen.

dean.

 

Please stick around C4

Tigger.

 

Dean:

Go back and re-read some of my posts. They were civil (As it was admitted first hand by the site moderator on a PM) and I challenge you to find any words such as "Constipated", "Bulbous"and such in any of my previous posts.

Perhaps this does not apply to you personally, but in the big scheme of things, the majority of R56 newbies here are very defensive of their car even if they are presented with a civil and respectful argument. You know what they do? Flood the moderator's inbox with complaints and whines because they feel Öh, so intimidated!

So don't take it so personal Dean. In Fact I don't find you to be in that camp at all. Trinity07 is another R56 newbie that has expressed his support and in despite of differing views he valued my input in this forum.

Skiploder or Chris Neal have not posted here in the past week. I suspect they too were silenced in despite of their civil debate.

Let's face it Dean, neither NAM nor Motoringfile are tolerant of what they perceive as critique of the R56.

 

You'll find me closer to home, Tigger! (On that other MINI site that you frequent so much)

 

I should have phrased things differently ...I was speaking about the folks that belittle the R56 as a whole. Sorry I made it sound like a personal attack, which it was not meant to be.

Thanks for the reply.

dean.

 

Newbie to Nam but Cooper owner since March 03. The fact is the opinions both pro and con are represented by approximately a dozen people expressly on this thread. The vast majority of people never post there opinions one way or another. I loved my 03 MINI more than any car I have ever owned. I am sure I will love my new Cooper S as much or more. Mini has designed an improved car that will appeal to the masses not necessarily the MINI enthusiasts or fanatics. Nothing wrong if you are one. Bottom line for me. I think overall the new R56 is a superior car and I upgraded to a 2007. Your choice. Buy it or don't. If you love MINI eventually you will move on to an 07,08,etc. If not Honda,VW,Mazda whatever. The choice is yours but please be respectfull to all MINI people. Most of us love are cars and someone other than the experts are unlikely to change our minds.

 

Not true. Constructive criticism and honest opinion is very welcome here. The problem stems from some people becoming so fierce and constant about it that it starts to become harassment - troll-like if you will. Some people are going to love everything about the R56, some are going to hate everything about it, and most, including myself, will find a lot of things they like and dislike at the same time. I am one of the people who also has posted my misgivings about the R56, and yes, I am very happy to remain in my R53. That doesn't mean I am going to go on a virulent campaign to slander everything about the R56!You couldn't be more wrong, C4. As I've made clear, everyone is entitled to their opinion, but there's a clear difference from expressing an opinion (however negative it may be) and discussing it... versus taking every single opportunity available to constantly get in people's faces about it. It's the difference between sitting at a debate table and having a civilized debate, and shoving your face into the others, screaming your opinion over and over.C4, you are welcome here. You weren't asked to stop posting, you were simply asked to "back off some". That's a reasonable request. And the example you gave, of another member who has expressed similar behavior (on other topics) in the past? Guess what - he was asked to back off too, months ago, and he did. You aren't the first to have this request made, and you certainly won't be the last. Don't feel singled out, you aren't a victim. I hope you change your mind and choose to stay, honestly! Don't make a mountain out of a molehill.

Despite your request to have your account completely deleted and all of your posts wiped, we haven't done it. Why? Because it isn't warranted. Because we believe you are making a rash and knee-jerk decision, and we hope you will come to realize that and stay an active member. Just one who isn't so excessively rabid about his hatred for the R56.Again, you're wrong. We aren't the thought police. We are the action police. Big difference. 120 posts in a single week to R56-related threads, all negative... is action that will get itself attention.

We're not asking you to change your mind, we're not asking you to leave. All we asked you to do is chill out a bit.For the record... I do agree that some R56 owners (or soon-to-be owners) are overly sensitive about negative R56 opinions. And I hope they "toughen up" about it too. But there's a balance on both ends that needs to be achieved, and constant R56-bashing isn't helping matters.

 

I just hope you guys have extended the same chill-out courtesy request to new posters (actually I can only think of one but I will not name them) who have been adamantly attacking the R53 & starting threads with the sole purpose of bashing & riling 1st gen owners because I am still seeing the inflamatory posts

 

you really dont' want me to go there with tolerance.. really sort of childish.. I tolerate each day of my life.. end of story.

I'm not here to judge. Just learn abuout the car and poeple - even you.

I think we should tell MINI to maybe bump their 10 billion combo slogan to like 10 trillion... each owner is theio own combionatin of the car.. making it even more dynamic..

I got a call from my german MA today - Java (this might be her new name) said she has arrived (: I should take delivery in about a week.

Got my insurance squared away
Got my bank work all taken care of

And made a new friend on NAM - all in a days work..

motor on.... ppl

 

PM me about it, bamatt. I don't have time to read every thread.

 

Actually, Edge, the post that you took my quote from was being very complimentary about this site, saying that debate and opinion seemed welcome.

Tigger.

 

her/she

I really hope all this bickering comes to an end soon. I dont understand any of the extreme bashing going on on either side. Some of the newbies are too sensitive because they love their new cars and the vets are defensive because virtually every review talks about how the R56 is better than their cars. Im pretty sure for the vast majority of the R56 owners (present and future), the 1st gen Mini is what attracted us in the first place. I hate the idea of losing some of the veteran posters around here because they have the most working knowledge of our cars and have valuable input. Hopefully we can all learn to put ourselves in other people's shoes before reacting and going off the deep end.

 

Actually, the remainder of the post I quoted said nothing more about the site, only your own impressions of the R56. This is the post we are talking about. I only quoted the part that talked about the site... and I especially did so because it was your post that triggered C4's post... which is the other one I quoted and replied to!

Unless by "MINI forum that I normally visit" meant another one? MINI2? µ? It's OK to say them by name. If you were talking about another site, not NAM... then my apologies... but I think perhaps C4 misunderstood which forum you meant too, with his response.

 

No doubt in my mind the 53 looks better than the 56. But, that doesn't make it a better car.

 

You haven't lived til you get a... Look dude... I get them all the time & I too am a chickie

 

With the R56 all taped up like that it looks dreadful. But take the tape off and ....

dean.

 

R53's chubby brother...

 

Am I the only one who likes them both? Honestly, I went to the launch event and didn't think the R56 looked anything like the pictures. I loved the interior, I probably like the exterior of the R53 better, and would have to autocross one to decide which one I ultimately liked better.

that is the big one to me. If the R56 beats the R53 in G stock in the next couple of years, then I can't see how you could say it is inferior.

Looks are just opinions, you can like it or not, doesn't matter.

 

Nope. Count me in. I like 'em both too! I like the way they both look and I like the way they both drive ...I could be happy with either of them.

I agree about the interior of the R56 ...it is so much better in real life than in the pictures. I find the same is true of the exterior. All of my objections were alleviated when I saw it in person.

dean.

 

Sorry, although it's my first day posting here, I've made a few posts and I've got them mixed up I was complimentary elsewhere

Yes, I was definately referring to another site, not NAM. Sorry for any misunderstanding.

Tigger.

 

It always makes me laugh when I get that

 

I'd venture to guess most of us do, especially after the nice R56 reviews and visits to the showroom. Really, it's just a means of continuing my enthusiasm for MINIs which I expect to carry over to new models as they become available.

 

I think that a few people are getting bent out of shape over nothing. Everyone has opinons. They're all valid . . . as opinions. Anyone that takes the opinionated words of someone as fact that they feel the need to get upset over, needs to have his own head examined (this is just an expression - please don't have a cow over it), imho. 'Oh, my God, 'Johnny Bravo' doesn't like the car that I like! AAAAUUUUGGGHH!!!' Puh-lease.

Zip