I just had my 2nd HORRIBLE service experience... this one at Long Beach Mini... I took my car in for leaking windows, trunk latch, and my 2nd attempt at fixing the cold start issue... anyways, SA says, "What, did you read that on the internet? It's not true. You know, those internet sites do more harm then good..."

He said there is no documented cold start issue, there is no PuMA measure. He said there is no such thing as a PuMA measure... I tried to show him everything I printed off from the Motoring File articles, but he said it was all falsified information. He said there is no such thing as a belt tensioner issue. Am I crazy or all we all crazy on this board? I am starting to lose faith in ALL mini dealerships... next stop will be South Bay Mini....

To boot, he was a complete *** about everything else... I was told "oh yeah, water will get inside the windows. As long as it's not dripping down the inside... You know what, that's fine... I told him not to worry about it, but are these cars really designed this way? NEVER happened in my Lexus GS, my Denali, or even my prior Hondas... For the trunk, he said "Well does it open and close? Then what's the problem?"...

When I picked my car up from Crevier when I got my clutch replaced and asked about the cold start, the answer was "oh yeah, it was fixed when we changed the clutch"... I am getting nothing but BS answers... am I being to nice? I never complain, and try to be very agreeable and understanding.. maybe if I turn into a royal a-hole they'll do something about it... anyways just thought I'd vent...

SO IS IT TRUE? IS THE COLD START CHATTER A SHAM?

 

Oh yeah, I also told him that people had success in replicating the issue, but he said that it was all BS... I told him that people have had it fixed, with Mini acknowledging the issue, he said it wasn't true.

 

You should call MINI USA directly and ask them yourself. Tell them what you read on motoring file and that you have been experiencing the problem and that two dealerships have failed/refused to repair it. Also tell them what you were told at Long Beach, including the name of this obviously useless SA who clearly has no business working at a MINI dealership... especially if he told you that water leaking in through the windows is normal in the MINI.

It most certainly is NOT!

I'm sure MINI USA will get the ball rolling on a proper repair for you, and once you're through with that and have all the correct information through channels that the dealership cannot ignore, call Long Beach back and ask to speak to their general manager and file a customer service complaint against this SA for LYING to you.

That's what I'd do.

 

good call, I am going to call Mini USA this afternoon....

 

Mini of Nashville says the noise is normal and that i should just get used to it. They can not replicate it so it must not exist. I have told them there is a TSB for this issue but they refuse to even acknowleadge that the car has any issue. I have a 2009 MCS before the factory started putting the fix on the cars from the start. I am pissed at them the next time it makes the noise i will go back and try again. I am in no way pleased with my service i gave them the puma number and they said that the information i read on the internet is not true. I am like fine print me the puma number off i gave you. I get a we can only pull by your cars Vin number i am thinking ither there system is a crock or my SA is

 

some of these dealers are their own little fiefdoms-- dont they talk to each other? Long Beach and other 'ships that deny this problem need to talk with Rasmussen, Motor City, and other MINI dealers that know this problem exists, and are working to resolve the problem.

maybe it's because they're in warmer S CA climates that cars there are not affected? It's a cold engine issue, not cold weather fcol.

 

Makes no sense they would act like that. It is warranty work via a TSB and the dealer gets paid by MINI.

A few threads have shown how to reliably replicate the issue. Try that at the dealer and if get no where call MINI USA and the BBB.

 

Refusal to repair a defect under warranty is grounds for a "lemon law" claim in most states. Check your rights under the lemon law, and notify the vehicle manufacturer, MINI USA, by registered mail of the defect and the refusal to repair it. That might get their attention, as I'm pretty sure they'd rather fix the car than give you a new one, or have to refund your purchase price.

California's lemon law rules are here: http://http://caag.state.ca.us/consu...eral/lemon.htm

 

I am in Tennesse I did capture the sound on video with a picture of the cars VIN. They were very unresponsive I have not had the noise a second time which we all know it will come back i will call them again and give then a second shot at it. In TN they have to refuse to repair the issue 3 times. Strike one just two more left. They even try to say the car has a TSB saying it makes a louder than normal noise due to the pump in the car. The SA was like my car makes this noise some times it is normal after sitting for twelve hours or more. I have plenty of time it is an 09 with 3400 miles on it i am going to let it make the noise again and then let them try again. The more times the try to dumber they look is my thoughts. Maybe i am not enraged enough idk

 

There's always a non-believer somewhere...

 

Marshall - White Roof Radio podcasts had an episode about the cold start, you might find it helpful. (Though I seem to recall them saying it only occurred in the extreme cold, not SoCA-type cold..?..)

 

we don't have EXTREME cold weather situations, but it was happening every day for a two week span where nightly lows were in the 40s... it also happened when it wasn't as cold, but I guess cold enough... i feels as if the chattering went away faster when it wasn't as cold... regardless, it was loud enough where my wife said "why does your car sound like that".... and believe me, she doesn't know much about cars...

dealer just called and said my car is ready to be picked up... obviously, couldnt replicate or diagnose any problem... so it was a fruitless journey...

 

#1 - Find a new dealer. Those incompetents don't deserve your patronage.
#2 - Remember that service advisors are schedulers, not mechanics. If a SA isn't familiar with the cold start timing chain rattle issue, the BMW computer reference for the trouble-shooting and fixing this problem is SIM-11-02-07.

We've been using a PuMA reference number here on the forum (I'm guilty of passing it along, too), but "PuMA" is BMW German for the tracking file of a particular vehicle's reported mechanical problem. Forget all PuMA references - we got it wrong ...

#3 - SIM-11-02-07 requires that the dealer tech verify excessive noise from the timing chain area prior to warranty work. The reported best way to reliably cause the chain rattle is to park the car overnight at the dealership in a significant nose-down attitude. Apparently, the tilting of the engine somehow aggravates the draining of the tensioner piston and it's filling with air overnight. Try it at home to see if it sets off your car. Did it 100% of the time on mine.

 

thanks. i will try that. since i've already burned through 2 local socal dealers, i guess i will be off to Irvine Mini for my next try...

after much reading, I do now understand that PuMA is in reference to tracking a particular vehicle... almost like a case #... so my bad there...

i'll try parking the car on a tilt today and will see what happens...

 

Go to Alexander Mini, I know it's not in the best neighborhood but they just fixed mine, replaced defective piston in the chain tensioner. They know about all the latest service bulletins. No questions asked, I told them it rattles in the morning, they left the car overnight, replaced the piston and the tensioner and also replaced my melted hood scoop with carbon fibre one for free. I just said I'd pay the difference for the scoop but they did it for free.
Anyway I think it still rattles but less. I'll go there again for the chain, vanos and other staff replacement maybe later or wait until there is a recall

 

That's interesting that they would deny such a widely known problem. I had my car in today for an ECU upgrade. While there, I asked the tech about the cold-start rattle. Mine has not developed it yet, but I wanted to know what they know. He laughed and said "they all do it eventually due to the <bad> tensioner design". He then said regardless of the fixes issued so far, it comes back.

Since he was honest about it, but acted like he was not supposed to say anything, I am not ID'ing the dealership.

 

I'll try Alexander Mini... I'm actually coming close to springing for a used 997 (still under warranty)... if that happens I won't even bother... I figure if I am going to deal with issues, I might as well get an even faster car with more power!!!

 

In this case I'd forget about Mini's problems and go for a Porsche but I still like bikes more....

 

Try SouthBay....they won't jack you around like that.

It's the only dealer in the LA/OC area that I even consider taking my car to.

 

Interesting response from Mini of Nashville. Had mine in last week with them and this was one of the issues I listed (has occured 3-4x on my Nov 08 build). They admitted it was an issue under the right conditions. Also said that the fix was expensive (for them), and still somewhat unproven so they're not quite ready to install it on mine. I can understand that, and am willing to hold off for a while. Was very happy with the service advisor, the explanation and how he handled my other issues.

 

Im guessing there be similar stories all over the place. Hopefully the dealers will be a bit more honest. My guess is this repair is quite expensive, and BMW is just being stupid about it. I bet they cant just repair everyone's that is having the issues, after all there arent enough parts. They are looking at all the cars since the 07 model needing this repair. Its probably quite expensive and they just aren't set up to do it. If they are smart they would just suck it up and fix them all but when the accountants get a hold of the cost in this current climate its not going to be easy to get the issue fixed.

 

I can verify you don't need cold weather to have this problem. On the weekend this cold start noise happened twice in temps. of 65 - 70 F, first time this has occurred. Car is a Feb. build MCS, had it for two months, and since I have only had rare opportunities to drive it weekends, has less than 350 miles on it!
Disappointing to say the least. I report this to the dealership, it's as if they have never heard of it... have to leave it overnight with them...

 

have the dealer park the car nose down overnight. I'd bet the rattle will appear...

 

My 2 month old Clubman started this noise the first weekend I got the car and I got NO HELP from MINI of Nashville. I too got it on Video and had the car towed in last week, then they wouldn't even return my calls to let me know they got the car, I finally got a hold of MINIUSA and put in a formal complaint. I was told on Wed that the dealer was able to replicate the noise and they had all the parts in stock but were waiting for Authorization from MINI. Then on Friday they left a message on my cell saying they got the ok but need parts . As Sziehr says MINI of Nashville is not very helpful at all. I wish I never bought another MINI!

 

I took mine in to my selling dealer - Baron MINI in KC- on the noise, my dealer acknowledged they had several complaints on it and tried the latest fix on one of their demos and that it hadn't cured it, but that if MINI came up with something more definitive thay'd be glad to do it on my car. Fast forward 2k miles and 2 months and I called them again on it and they said they have the parts and all I need to do is let them know when I want it done. I have an appointment for this week...........mine is a Jan build, Feb delivery '09 Clubman S