Hole in my Radiator?! HELP!
#26
07-30-2010 | 11:46 AM
3rd Gear
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 253
Likes: 0
From: Calabash NC "Seafood Capital of the World"
I don't know how you got "fanboy" out of my post????
In no way do I think MINI is bulletproof, problem free or anything else. I've owned two of them so far, and neither has been trouble free.....
My post is strictly aimed at those who think EVERY thing that happens to their car is somehow the fault of the mfr., whether brand new or 100K down the road.
I've seen people post here how they ran into a curb and bent a wheel or control arm and want to know if that would be covered under warranty? I think this, unfortunately, falls under a similar situation. The OP is upset and doesn't want to shell out for an expensive repair and he wants someone - anyone else - to pay for it.
I asked, respectfully, in my earlier post how this could be MINI's fault and responsibility. I wanted to know how the OP saw it happening, if in fact it was the car's fault? The only reply I've seen is that it must have been there all along and chose this time to 'blow".......given the size of the stream of water coming from the hole in the first pic I think that's nonsense. I base my OPINION on 30 years of repairing cars, both to make my living and to help friends and family members with theirs.
I did commiserate with the OP and the fact that it's a new car, but for him to fold his arms and state unequivocally that it's MINI's fault and responsibility shows me both that he has little car knowledge to base his stance on and little understanding of what a car warranty is for.
I wish him luck, and maybe he will be able to bully someone into paying for it, but that doesn't mean he's right......it just means he's a good bully or maybe very persuasive.
Like another poster has in his signature "opinions are like exhaust pipes, everyone has at least one"
In no way do I think MINI is bulletproof, problem free or anything else. I've owned two of them so far, and neither has been trouble free.....
My post is strictly aimed at those who think EVERY thing that happens to their car is somehow the fault of the mfr., whether brand new or 100K down the road.
I've seen people post here how they ran into a curb and bent a wheel or control arm and want to know if that would be covered under warranty? I think this, unfortunately, falls under a similar situation. The OP is upset and doesn't want to shell out for an expensive repair and he wants someone - anyone else - to pay for it.
I asked, respectfully, in my earlier post how this could be MINI's fault and responsibility. I wanted to know how the OP saw it happening, if in fact it was the car's fault? The only reply I've seen is that it must have been there all along and chose this time to 'blow".......given the size of the stream of water coming from the hole in the first pic I think that's nonsense. I base my OPINION on 30 years of repairing cars, both to make my living and to help friends and family members with theirs.
I did commiserate with the OP and the fact that it's a new car, but for him to fold his arms and state unequivocally that it's MINI's fault and responsibility shows me both that he has little car knowledge to base his stance on and little understanding of what a car warranty is for.
I wish him luck, and maybe he will be able to bully someone into paying for it, but that doesn't mean he's right......it just means he's a good bully or maybe very persuasive.
Like another poster has in his signature "opinions are like exhaust pipes, everyone has at least one"
.......................
#27
07-30-2010 | 12:23 PM
2nd Gear
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 93
Likes: 0
Since I made this post much has happened.
I went down to take a look at the car. The damage is only on the BACK of the Radiator. It did not fly through the grill. The service advisor told me (with a serious face) that a rock flew under the car, upward AND backwards into the radiator while I was driving. Not only that, but it went THROUGH a spinning fan. Check out the pics. How is something like this possible??
I went down to take a look at the car. The damage is only on the BACK of the Radiator. It did not fly through the grill. The service advisor told me (with a serious face) that a rock flew under the car, upward AND backwards into the radiator while I was driving. Not only that, but it went THROUGH a spinning fan. Check out the pics. How is something like this possible??
For such a small hole, and such a large repair price, I'd be hitting up radiator repair places to see if they can fix it "in situ." Or I'd be trying out some Alumalloy to see if it will stop the leak.
#28
07-30-2010 | 12:42 PM
3rd Gear
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 253
Likes: 0
From: Calabash NC "Seafood Capital of the World"
#29
07-30-2010 | 12:54 PM
6th Gear
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 3,789
Likes: 10
From: Kansas City
I've never seen a modern aluminum radiator successfully repaired, but then usually they fail at the plastic caps.
I think there's a good chance this one could be repaired, possibly even in the car, that would sure be a less expensive way to get it back on the road.
The overriding concern I always have when a customer is convinced they've been wronged by the MFR - right or wrong - is they then either hate the car and pick it apart the rest of the time they own it, or they continually badmouth the mfr and the dealer to anyone who will listen, and that isn't fair.
I think there's a good chance this one could be repaired, possibly even in the car, that would sure be a less expensive way to get it back on the road.
The overriding concern I always have when a customer is convinced they've been wronged by the MFR - right or wrong - is they then either hate the car and pick it apart the rest of the time they own it, or they continually badmouth the mfr and the dealer to anyone who will listen, and that isn't fair.
#30
07-30-2010 | 01:37 PM
So I guess the next question would be:
How does a hole at the bottom of the radiator cause coolant to literally explode all over the engine bay. I understand leaking out from the bottom but it was even on the hood... Pretty stupid design if its just that easy for rocks on the road to fly in and destroy the whole damn car.
Don't worry, there is no way in hell I'd ever pay them $1800 for a radiator.
I've been on the phone with the stealer and Mini Corporate. I'm not going down without a fight.... plus I still havent gotten that survey they're all so scared of
How does a hole at the bottom of the radiator cause coolant to literally explode all over the engine bay. I understand leaking out from the bottom but it was even on the hood... Pretty stupid design if its just that easy for rocks on the road to fly in and destroy the whole damn car.
Don't worry, there is no way in hell I'd ever pay them $1800 for a radiator.
I've been on the phone with the stealer and Mini Corporate. I'm not going down without a fight.... plus I still havent gotten that survey they're all so scared of
Having said that, I just bought 2 radiators for minis in my shop (bodyshop) and paid less than 200 bucks each from Modine.
When you buy a radiator, it won't be made by Mini (BMW) anyways, most of the time, they sublet it and purchase it from say Modine and stamp their names on it.
If you haven't found a radiator yet (I'm assuming you have since the post is almost a week old) let me know, I'll order you one at my cost and ship it to you.
You should have it installed from a bodyshop for about a 100 bucks.
If I can help, PM me...
Mark
#31
07-30-2010 | 02:11 PM
4th Gear
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 509
Likes: 0
From: Southeast PA
Mark has given you the best option!! All hail Mark!!! NAM is a great bunch.
Find out who your dealer uses for collision repairs or the best independent shop from MINI Club members in your area. Often the local Clubs have a go-to repair person .... or might even organize a MINI radiator repair day so everyone can help and learn together.
Those that can make the repair .... DO IT.
Those that can't supply the beer and food!!
Bob
Find out who your dealer uses for collision repairs or the best independent shop from MINI Club members in your area. Often the local Clubs have a go-to repair person .... or might even organize a MINI radiator repair day so everyone can help and learn together.
Those that can make the repair .... DO IT.
Those that can't supply the beer and food!!
Bob
#32
07-30-2010 | 07:05 PM
6th Gear
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,821
Likes: 1
From: Mililani,Hawaii
If this was your one week old new car, I'm sure you would be mad as hell too, especially if they were trying to stick you with the bill.What did he say that was wrong?
OP - One of the scariest things you mentioned was driving it with the overheating light on. You have no idea how, hmm.. how to say this nicely, "less than smart" that is. Your $1800 quote could easily have become a $9800 quote for a new engine. If you ever see that light again, pull over, kill the engine, and have it towed to the dealership.
#33
07-30-2010 | 10:57 PM
Neutral
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: Sunny So Cal
Hey guys, there is a better solution that only one person has touched on so far.
The car is new with very few miles on it. Yes, it sucks that somehow, someway you have damage (read: NOT a manufacturing defect) to a brand new car BUT there is hope.
Unfortunately, the dealer service dept cannot warranty the radiator with that hole in it. You see, when a warranty repair is performed, the factory asks for the part back so that they can find out how/why it failed so they can engineer better more reliable parts or find a better, more reliable supplier.
The claim gets paid BUT if a physically damaged part is returned that shows evidence of damage and not a defect, the claim gets debited and the dealer ends up "eating the repair" (They have to pay for it). Which makes for a very irrate service manager.
Now, what the OP can do since the service dept has already said NO warranty is to ask VERY NICELY if the store can make a "one time goodwill repair" and cover the cost of the parts and the labor, since the car is so new, you have shown loyalty to the dealer by purchasing/leasing it from them, and that you will continue to service your car at Nick Alexander and that you are just basically looking for some help (or "love") due to the cost of the repair. This needs to be communicated to the service manager or director. The service advisor has absolutely NO power to make this request a reality.
WHATEVER YOU DO, DO NOT THREATEN TO TRASH THE STORE ON THE SURVEY.
That survey is about YOUR BUYING EXPERIENCE and your interaction with the salesperson. Please, please, please understand that nowadays, the salesperson stands to make MO $$ by getting excellent survey's, than by the actual commission on the sale of the car. There is NO WAY that survey is connected to the experience that you are now going through. it is ALL ABOUT THE SALES/LEASE EXPERIENCE.
If you were happy with your lease/purchase (and not the current situation) dont punish the salesperson PLUS if you do trash the store, the service dept will catch wind of it and then you will NEVER be treated properly!
If you don't ask, you won't get. The worst the director can say is NO. If that happens, move up the chain - Service Manager, General Sales Manager, General Manager, Dealer Principal, and finally the Owner.
All MINI corporate will do is to referr you (ie: bounce you back) to your selling or servicing dealer to make the ultimate decision. You will waste your time by talking to them.
GOOD LUCK
and keep us "posted" on your quest for the radiator grail!
The car is new with very few miles on it. Yes, it sucks that somehow, someway you have damage (read: NOT a manufacturing defect) to a brand new car BUT there is hope.
Unfortunately, the dealer service dept cannot warranty the radiator with that hole in it. You see, when a warranty repair is performed, the factory asks for the part back so that they can find out how/why it failed so they can engineer better more reliable parts or find a better, more reliable supplier.
The claim gets paid BUT if a physically damaged part is returned that shows evidence of damage and not a defect, the claim gets debited and the dealer ends up "eating the repair" (They have to pay for it). Which makes for a very irrate service manager.
Now, what the OP can do since the service dept has already said NO warranty is to ask VERY NICELY if the store can make a "one time goodwill repair" and cover the cost of the parts and the labor, since the car is so new, you have shown loyalty to the dealer by purchasing/leasing it from them, and that you will continue to service your car at Nick Alexander and that you are just basically looking for some help (or "love") due to the cost of the repair. This needs to be communicated to the service manager or director. The service advisor has absolutely NO power to make this request a reality.
WHATEVER YOU DO, DO NOT THREATEN TO TRASH THE STORE ON THE SURVEY.
That survey is about YOUR BUYING EXPERIENCE and your interaction with the salesperson. Please, please, please understand that nowadays, the salesperson stands to make MO $$ by getting excellent survey's, than by the actual commission on the sale of the car. There is NO WAY that survey is connected to the experience that you are now going through. it is ALL ABOUT THE SALES/LEASE EXPERIENCE.
If you were happy with your lease/purchase (and not the current situation) dont punish the salesperson PLUS if you do trash the store, the service dept will catch wind of it and then you will NEVER be treated properly!
If you don't ask, you won't get. The worst the director can say is NO. If that happens, move up the chain - Service Manager, General Sales Manager, General Manager, Dealer Principal, and finally the Owner.
All MINI corporate will do is to referr you (ie: bounce you back) to your selling or servicing dealer to make the ultimate decision. You will waste your time by talking to them.
GOOD LUCK
and keep us "posted" on your quest for the radiator grail!
#34
07-31-2010 | 04:37 AM
I highly doubt that any dealership will "goodwill" an 1800 repair that clearly shows a hole in the radiator.
I've been in the automotive business for almost 30 years, the better part of that working for dealerships. Mini is tight and though that process works on many manufacturers (more so high end cars like Mercedes or Lexus) I highly doubt mini will goodwill a radiator that has a hole in it.
I had to pull my O2 sensor SEVERAL times because of an issue with my downpipe coming loose. Point is, the threads became gaulded (sp?) even though I used anti-seize on them.
I replaced the sensor and while I was talking to the parts rep, he said yes, that's quite common and he has replaced many under warranty.
Granted, I did the work myself but because both of my bodyshops have a working relationship with the dealership itself (and the other 3-4 immediately next to them owned by the same company) you'd think that they could have warrantied or goodwill'd an O2 sensor.
But nope, not Mini, they have no sympathy towards their customers. In fact, I'm going to make a post in a few minutes asking to see if anyone has gotten something substantial done as "goodwill".
I do agree with your thought process, it can't hurt to ask but I highly doubt they'll take pity.
Mark
I've been in the automotive business for almost 30 years, the better part of that working for dealerships. Mini is tight and though that process works on many manufacturers (more so high end cars like Mercedes or Lexus) I highly doubt mini will goodwill a radiator that has a hole in it.
I had to pull my O2 sensor SEVERAL times because of an issue with my downpipe coming loose. Point is, the threads became gaulded (sp?) even though I used anti-seize on them.
I replaced the sensor and while I was talking to the parts rep, he said yes, that's quite common and he has replaced many under warranty.
Granted, I did the work myself but because both of my bodyshops have a working relationship with the dealership itself (and the other 3-4 immediately next to them owned by the same company) you'd think that they could have warrantied or goodwill'd an O2 sensor.
But nope, not Mini, they have no sympathy towards their customers. In fact, I'm going to make a post in a few minutes asking to see if anyone has gotten something substantial done as "goodwill".
I do agree with your thought process, it can't hurt to ask but I highly doubt they'll take pity.
Mark
#35
07-31-2010 | 01:29 PM
Neutral
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: Sunny So Cal
Remember, the $1,800 is RETAIL (and a bloated retail at that). If the repair gets goodwilled, it goes as a warranty repair at warranty labor and warranty parts cost so the store is probably only out $800 to 1K. Not that much in the grand scheme of things.
And Goodwill is just that ... GOODWILL.
MINI corporate (read:BMWNA) gives the dealer a goodwill budget every month or quarter. It can be used at the stores discretion to "take care" of any issues that are NOT warrantable.
Given the situation, the amount of miles on the car and a car that is probably within the first 90 days of ownership, there is a high probabality that it can be taken care of ... it's just going to take some POLITE pushing by the OP.
Again, OC, I'm not discounting your point, just meerely saying that considering the situation, the right thing the store should do is take care of it without asking the owner for $$
And Goodwill is just that ... GOODWILL.
MINI corporate (read:BMWNA) gives the dealer a goodwill budget every month or quarter. It can be used at the stores discretion to "take care" of any issues that are NOT warrantable.
Given the situation, the amount of miles on the car and a car that is probably within the first 90 days of ownership, there is a high probabality that it can be taken care of ... it's just going to take some POLITE pushing by the OP.
Again, OC, I'm not discounting your point, just meerely saying that considering the situation, the right thing the store should do is take care of it without asking the owner for $$
#36
07-31-2010 | 02:20 PM
Again, OC, I'm not discounting your point, just meerely saying that considering the situation, the right thing the store should do is take care of it without asking the owner for $$
Mark
#37
08-01-2010 | 10:27 AM
4th Gear
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 367
Likes: 0
From: Midwest
OP, if you lose the battle, you should look for a specialist in your area that works on MINI's. The radiator itself is not that expensive. The labor is where the dealership is killing you.
Click on cooling. The radiator is 276.51 plus shipping.
http://www.penskeparts.com/DiagramsM...7&rnd=06222010
Click on cooling. The radiator is 276.51 plus shipping.
http://www.penskeparts.com/DiagramsM...7&rnd=06222010
#38
08-01-2010 | 10:36 AM
4th Gear
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 367
Likes: 0
From: Midwest
I know I'm a little late on responding to this post but I wouldn't waste my breath with Mini. You have a hole in your radiator, pure and simple... it's not a warranty case at all.
Having said that, I just bought 2 radiators for minis in my shop (bodyshop) and paid less than 200 bucks each from Modine.
When you buy a radiator, it won't be made by Mini (BMW) anyways, most of the time, they sublet it and purchase it from say Modine and stamp their names on it.
If you haven't found a radiator yet (I'm assuming you have since the post is almost a week old) let me know, I'll order you one at my cost and ship it to you.
You should have it installed from a bodyshop for about a 100 bucks.
If I can help, PM me...
Mark
Having said that, I just bought 2 radiators for minis in my shop (bodyshop) and paid less than 200 bucks each from Modine.
When you buy a radiator, it won't be made by Mini (BMW) anyways, most of the time, they sublet it and purchase it from say Modine and stamp their names on it.
If you haven't found a radiator yet (I'm assuming you have since the post is almost a week old) let me know, I'll order you one at my cost and ship it to you.
You should have it installed from a bodyshop for about a 100 bucks.
If I can help, PM me...
Mark
OC, you're a good man for offering this to the OP.
#39
08-01-2010 | 11:05 AM
6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,880
Likes: 3
From: Your Worst Nightmare :)
Have seen this happen many many times.
Now it seems to be spreading to HPFPs and carbon buildup (you used bad gas, you idiot)Also I remember reading somewhere on NAM that MINIDave works (or used to work) for Baron MINI in KC, which may explain his profuse and verbose propensity to defend the dealer and the brand. MD if I'm wrong, please correct, thanks.
Last edited by sequence; 08-01-2010 at 11:18 AM.
#40
08-01-2010 | 11:11 AM
#41
08-01-2010 | 11:13 AM
6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,880
Likes: 3
From: Your Worst Nightmare :)
#42
08-01-2010 | 03:16 PM
6th Gear
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 3,789
Likes: 10
From: Kansas City
My dealership experience is with MBZ, Porsche, Lexus, Jaguar, Ranger Rover, Audi and a few others....
And for the last time, I did not defend the dealer or the brand in this thread, I merely pointed out that the OP's postition wes not defendable in this case, based on my considered experience. I would appreciate it if you'd get your facts straight before you besmirch my good name here......
#43
08-01-2010 | 04:12 PM
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