Hi Guys,

I have my WP MCS on order, and I expect to get delivery sometime in July. After reading many posts about the windshield, I am very concerned. I am appalled by hearing the number of people replacing their WS 4-6 times!!.

I called ASK-MINi and asked them about it. She said they are aware of the problem, and that my Mini will be built with an improved version. It's a bit hard to follow the threads, but does anyone have a veredict on how the new OEM windshields perform? I have ordered the autosensing wipers, and I am worried about replacing the OEM with the PPG version and loosing this functionality, or having ill-working intermitent wipers.

I know this has been discussed before, but I think us new owners could benefit by finding out exactly where the new WS stands.

Thanks,
Nando

 

Nando - - -

If you do a careful search you will find complaints about almost every aspect of the MINI Cooper, its dealers, and MINI-USA. Just ignore all the posts from the whiners! Your time will be better spent reading about all of the positive aspects of this wonderful little car and building your anticipation for the July delivery.

The MINI Cooper is a CHEAP CAR! To bring a $16,500 car to the marketplace with the performance, handling, appearance, and tradition of the MINI it was necessary to cut production costs wherever practical. There are a large number of snap together parts - - reducing the parts count and reducing the assembly time - - but this leads to some rattles. Not as much production line time/effort is spent on quality control as is spent on a BMW 7 series, but at less than 1/4 the price that should be expected. There are surprisingly few engineering goofs on the MINI - and the windshield is the prime example - but with all the money and expertise available to NASA, there still have been catastrophic failures.

Even though the MC is a cheap car at $16,500, it is easy to more than double the price with premium packages, superchargers, Works kit, etc. This increase in price increases the performance of the car, not the build quaility. IMO many of the whiners on this and other boards think that because they paid $25K-$30K for their car at a BMW dealer they deserve the level of support afforded at Series 7 or Lexus buyer.

I’m an old fart - - bought 20+ new cars (and quite a few used ones) since my first new car in 1956. My MCS/JCW is more fun to drive than any other new car that I’ve owned - - including a BMW roadster and two ragtop ‘Vettes. If something breaks, then I’ll fix it. If too many things break, then I’ll sell it - - but I damn sure won’t spend my time on the MINI forums trying to spoil the enjoyment of others!

 

Nick-

YOU ARE THE MAN!!! Finally someone says it like it is! Thank you. Everyone should read your post for enlightenment. The MINI is an incredible value given the price/performance.

 

>>does anyone have a veredict on how the new OEM windshields perform?

Nando, yes, someone does have a verdict on the new OEM windshields. Click here for a verdict on the "new" windshield...

Enjoy the answer to your question!

 

My MINI is a very good car
MY dealer,service is very good
The car runs ALL the time.
I'm happy so far ,and I feel like it will just keep rolling.
Don't try and burst my bubble,this is a good car :smile:

 

>>>>does anyone have a veredict on how the new OEM windshields perform?
>>
>>Nando, yes, someone does have a verdict on the new OEM windshields. Click here for a verdict on the "new" windshield...
>>
>>Enjoy the answer to your question!

Nick, Well said, thanks.

I had read the thread above, but there is no conclusive answer as to the wether the "New" windshield is more resistant. The one case, the crack was caused by a rock. I would rather NOT get the rain sensing wipers, if I will replace the OEM windshield with a PPG windshield.

 

>>I would rather NOT get the rain sensing wipers, if I will replace the OEM windshield with a PPG windshield.

You're right! Why spend the extra $$$ on rain sensing wipers. (I lived in the rainy NW for nearly 30 years of my life without them and got along just fine) I say, don't get them...

 

Nando, the rain sensing wipers aren't so wonderful that you must have them, though doesn't that feature come in a package with the auto-dimming rearview mirror? That's not a bad feature.

I need to replace a windshield, and if it saves enough money and I can get the stronger aftermarket version, then I'll forgo the rain-sensing aspect of my windshield setup, 'cause it's not SO great.

I wouldn't get yourself all worried about it! Get good glass coverage through your insurance to cover you in the event that warranty won't cover it. And ENJOY!!

 

I just posted this on the other thread about the 'new' windshields, but I'll post it again here:

For those of you so concerned about road debris or rocks going right through your windshield, take heart in what happened t o me:

I have a Jan '03 build MCS. Last November I was hit by some MAJOR road debris - 3 or 4 pieces of sharp-edged aluminum roughly 6" long x 3" wide x 1/4" thick - probably ladder treads that had been run over a few times and broken up. I was second in a group of 5 MINIs caravaning up to Irvine; when we moved over a lane to take an exit, a large white delivery truck in front of us kicked up the road debris which went flying into the air. It went up over the first car and struck mine. My windshield was totalled. All the other cars got away without a scratch... Up to this point I had never had a crack in my windshield; lots of pitting, but no cracks. I'd had the car for about 9 months and had about 13,000 miles on her.

We pulled off the freeway as quickly as we could and I called my insurance company while my companions checked out my car for other damage. Fortunately no sheet metal was touched (phew!) but there was a piece of mangled aluminum sticking STRAIGHT OUT of my front bumper! We actually had to yank hard on the thing for it to come out!

Fortunately the points of impact (2 or 3) on the windshield all fell on the passenger side, so I could still see out reasonably well. The windshield had cracks running through the entire thing, and 'bullet hole' type spiderwebbing from the points of impact. I was a bit afraid to drive the car for fear that the glass might just start falling out, but then one of my friends had a good look at it and told me that the interior glass was still intact. Apparently modern windshields are made with two pieces of glass which have a thin membrane between them to help hold them together in accidents such as mine.

Well, after calling around to all the dealers in SoCal to see if they had any in stock (I have rain sensing wipers - and I LOVE them!) none did. I was due to drive to AZ for Thanksgiving in a couple of days, so I checked with MINI North Scottsdale. They had two in stock. Long story short, I drove to PHX a couple days later with the cracked windshield and had no problems whatsoever along the way. Safelite of PHX replaced my glass and it's been fine since.

After that I've determined that while these windshiels may be cr@p for pitting and chips, they're really not terrible for safety. And after all that MINI's done to make the car safe, I really don't think they'd allow use of unsafe glass.

PS My original glass had been hit a number of times by large pebbles and stones without getting any chips. The new (OEM) glass has one small chip and I've had it for about as many miles as I had the original glass. If PPG made glass for the sensing wipers, I'd eventually get one just for the visibility of not having all those pits. But until then, I'm okay with OEM.

 

You're also missing the point that while some people have been plagued by stress cracks, a whole lot more are not...

I've been lucky, I've never had a single stress crack. I don't mention it in any of the stress crack posts because I KNOW that the people who are suffering from stress cracks really don't care if I haven't had an issue. Just like when I ask a question about the Nav system I really don't care, or want to hear from the people who choose not to get one.

Honestly I don't think the majority of MINIs have a problem with stress cracks. However it's without a doubt a major problem on those MINIs that do.

What you can be almost guaranteed of with your windshield is pits... lots and lots of pits.

Spec out your MINI the way you want, don't worry about the complaints on the forums...

 

Nando,
Nick T has got it right. But his solution is rather black and white. I would rather think of treating it more in the gray area. If my cracked windscreen is not covered by warranty because of the infamous "pen test"` then I simply drive it until it cracks again. When it gets real irritating and/or I get a fix it citation then I'll put in PPG glass. I'll do this until the warranty runs out and or I'v paid for 2 windscreen out of my own pocket, then I sell it. Unfortunatly there is not a PPG for rain sensor windscreens at this time so I would advise against getting that feature or be prepared to pay high $ for an OEM replacement.

 

since when was 16.5k a small sum of money?

that's like 3300 chipotle burritos!

mmm... chipotle...

 

I wonder how many chipotle burritos will fit in a Mini? Would that many burritos be enough to double the price of the car? :smile:

 

I can see a concern with the PPG rain sensor currently not available but they may introduce it by the time you need a replacement. Hopefully a few years out.

Nick T. had well chosen words in his comment these cars need a little effort to keep them right. This site gives you great information but can overload your decision process. Take the negative comments subjectively and go with your best informed decision.

 

I have 224 miles on my new '04 MC and my (up-graded) windshield has not yet cracked and my Midlands gearbox has not yet self-destructed. My boot lid still closes OK, and I haven't had any water leaks. No seat rattles either. Whew, who knew the MINI was such a ticking time bomb! Think I'll make it to 500 miles before a catastrophe?

In a similar vein. Before he bought his 2nd generation Miata a couple of years ago, my friend checked out all of the Miata websites. They were full of complaints about the Miata - you know, like the compalints about the MINI. He finally stopped logging in and just went ahead and bought a new Miata. Over 20,000 miles later and not one little tiny single problem. His comment to me was to ignore the MINI websites and just get the car.

One last comment. I definitely would not get the rain sensing windshield. More expensive to replace - and, after all, do you mean to tell me that you can't sense when it is raining?!

 

>>I wonder how many chipotle burritos will fit in a Mini? Would that many burritos be enough to double the price of the car? :smile:
>>
>>not sure how many will fit but you can keep them warm in the glove box

 

.
>>
>>One last comment. I definitely would not get the rain sensing windshield. More expensive to replace - and, after all, do you mean to tell me that you can't sense when it is raining?!

 

>>>since when was 16.5k a small sum of money?

>>>that's like 3300 chipotle burritos!

>>>mmm... chipotle...


At "El Famous Burrito", I can get 3,666 and 2/3 of the "football size" burritos for that sum!

Still Enjoying "waiting to wait",
Tatt

 

For as expensive as Chipotle burritos are you would think that they wouldn't produce so much flatulence. I've complained to Chipotle North America many times about this. Man, I'll be glad when the new PPG replacement burritos are available!

 

Nando, don't worry about the people on here who are so quick to jump up and belittle someone for voicing a problem with their car. They are quick to label them as "immature" and "whiners". It's really annoying when people promote an atmosphere where no one feels safe to come onto a forum to find solutions to one of their problems. That is not the community spirit that is intended here on NAM. There are people out here that do support each other...helping with each other's problems. The only way we know you have a problem is by posting it as asking for assistance. But if the people asking for assistance are belittled for pointing out they have an issue, then there'd be much less discussion and solutions given to problems.

All said, feel free to ignore the people who belittle others that might voice they have a problem with their MINI.

 

The mini is the first new car I have ever purchased, and I am very happy with it.

BUT do $17,000 hondas, toyotas or any other car for that matter have as many rattles?.....My girlfriend's 2002 chevy doesn't rattle like my dash does in cold weather

whiners aside....It SEEMS like there are alot of little production bugs still to be worked... the car is still a great car to own I would not change my mind....but that doesn't mean these bugs and windshields should not be fixed

 

>>The mini is the first new car I have ever purchased, and I am very happy with it.
>>
>>BUT do $17,000 hondas, toyotas or any other car for that matter have as many rattles?.....My girlfriend's 2002 chevy doesn't rattle like my dash does in cold weather
>>
>>whiners aside....It SEEMS like there are alot of little production bugs still to be worked... the car is still a great car to own I would not change my mind....but that doesn't mean these bugs and windshields should not be fixed
>>
>>ditto on the first new car
my dealer has fixed ever little issue I have had with my MINI,right away,not going to bother with the list right now,but it's goes from computers to latchs
I like how my MINI runs ALOT

 

Nando -

I join with the comments not to worry about your recent purchase. Although I am also a victim of the windscreen problem, I would not for a minute think of driving anything else as you would be hard-pressed to purchase the type of performace offered by the MINI for anywhere near its cost.

Other than the stress crack issue, I do suspect that the MINI glass is more prone to rock damage due to its upright position which runs counter to the far more aerodynamic placement of many windscreens on modern automobiles. As such, the glass absorbs, rather than deflects these hits.

I do disagree with the general gripes concerning the build quality as the MINI is a solid little car and, at least in my case, is put together better than anything I've owned before (24+ cars, many new). The reality is that a few rattles are simply unavoidable given the rigidity of the body structure and stiffness of the suspension.

Remember, as a car loved by driving enthusiasts, we tend to be more critical and passionate about our vehicles; you just need to read through complaints with that in mind.

Motor On! :smile:

 

Wow Nick T.
I paid 23,000 for my Cooper S and I think I have the right to complain if my windshield has a stress crack 9 inches long as it does now. Of course if it were replaced under warranty as it should be I wouldn't have a problem. But of course they won't do that because it has several rock chips in various places on the rest of the windshield further proving how crappy the windshield is. As I felt like telling them when they pointed that out.
If you are an old fart than how many windshields have you had to replace in your lifetime? I'm guessing very few if any, and their are people that have gone through 3 and 4 within 2 years of ownership of their MINI.

And why exactly shouldn't I expect the same treatment as a 7 Series owner? They want to charge me $800 to fix the windshield. Sounds like they think I own a 70,000 dollar car with that price. :smile:

Sorry for the whining but we still have freedom of speech don't we? And as a prospective buyer I would think you would want to know everything about the car you are about to buy. Peace.

 

>>Other than the stress crack issue, I do suspect that the MINI glass is more prone to rock damage due to its upright position which runs counter to the far more aerodynamic placement of many windscreens on modern automobiles. As such, the glass absorbs, rather than deflects these hits.
______________
Up until yesterday, I have been singing the praises of the MINI: 23k miles with no windshield failure. But fate caught up with me, as I drove out of my garage, I noticed a 4 5/8" horiz crack from the A-pillar. Not a single pit or chip on the windshield closer than 9 inches from the near end of the crack.

My take on this windshield problem is that it is either a design or installation problem resulting from the very rigid body of the MINI (remember, it has 30% more welds than the BMW). While a rigid body may be OK in most cases, what does it do to parts that CAN'T flex under stress, such as glass? Something's gotta give.

My question for those with cracked windshields: did you have to get the approval of the Regional Manager (not the dealer's Service manager) to OK your windshield replacement? The Regional Manager covers a region so it may be weeks before he shows up. Believe it or not, this is what my service manager told me.

I think this ia a bunch of cockamanny. They're probably hoping that I'd be picking up more windshield chips in the meantime so they can then blame it on road hazard and pass on the responsibility to my insurance carrier.

_________________
<P><img src="https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...t;</img>
Don't hassle me. I'm driving as fast as I possibly can</P>