Limp mode - R57
#1
Limp mode - R57
2012 R57 with 81k miles
The other day I went to accelerate hard & all heck broke loose (or didn't - but a cheerful flashing half-engine warning did start flashing.)
I limped home & put my generic code reader on the car -- got a P0300 and P0597. It's had the P0597 for a while; I was being lazy about getting to it since it seems like a pain to replace the whole thermostat housing.
In any case - this car is my wife's & she does lots of very short trips, rarely airs it out, etc. It would not be the first time I've had buildup issues on one of her turbo cars from lack of aggressive driving.
I got serious about trying to diagnose this today. After reading endless posts, I pulled all the coils & visually inspected them. None looked obviously burnt up. I pulled the plugs & they didn't seem remarkable. They were Denso's so they'd been replaced in the past. I put in new NGKs just because it is often recommended. After this I started the car up. Somewhat rough idle, still flashing the half-engine light. Won't rev past 4k. I took it for a drive in 1st gear around the neighborhood to warm it up. It's obviously missing during acceleration & is clearly in limp mode since it loses all power above 4k until it's back below 4k. After getting it up to operating temperature, nothing much was changing. Relatively smooth operation at 3k, missing on acceleration, nothing above 4k.
Got home to a host of codes - P0597, P0300, P0302, P0304, P0303, B2aaa (I guess only cylinder 1 isn't misfiring? Seems odd)
So it's misfiring everywhere it seems. Based on my reading, I'm suspicious of HPFP (ouch, pricey), or it needs all new coils (yay, cheap & easy). Is there anything I can do to pin this down further? I don't want to just randomly replace parts hoping for a miracle. One last weirdness -- the car sat for a week after this happened. When I went out to work on it, the 1.5 yo battery was next to dead -- not enough juice to start. I put it on a charger & haven't had an issue since.
Thanks,
Mark
The other day I went to accelerate hard & all heck broke loose (or didn't - but a cheerful flashing half-engine warning did start flashing.)
I limped home & put my generic code reader on the car -- got a P0300 and P0597. It's had the P0597 for a while; I was being lazy about getting to it since it seems like a pain to replace the whole thermostat housing.
In any case - this car is my wife's & she does lots of very short trips, rarely airs it out, etc. It would not be the first time I've had buildup issues on one of her turbo cars from lack of aggressive driving.
I got serious about trying to diagnose this today. After reading endless posts, I pulled all the coils & visually inspected them. None looked obviously burnt up. I pulled the plugs & they didn't seem remarkable. They were Denso's so they'd been replaced in the past. I put in new NGKs just because it is often recommended. After this I started the car up. Somewhat rough idle, still flashing the half-engine light. Won't rev past 4k. I took it for a drive in 1st gear around the neighborhood to warm it up. It's obviously missing during acceleration & is clearly in limp mode since it loses all power above 4k until it's back below 4k. After getting it up to operating temperature, nothing much was changing. Relatively smooth operation at 3k, missing on acceleration, nothing above 4k.
Got home to a host of codes - P0597, P0300, P0302, P0304, P0303, B2aaa (I guess only cylinder 1 isn't misfiring? Seems odd)
So it's misfiring everywhere it seems. Based on my reading, I'm suspicious of HPFP (ouch, pricey), or it needs all new coils (yay, cheap & easy). Is there anything I can do to pin this down further? I don't want to just randomly replace parts hoping for a miracle. One last weirdness -- the car sat for a week after this happened. When I went out to work on it, the 1.5 yo battery was next to dead -- not enough juice to start. I put it on a charger & haven't had an issue since.
Thanks,
Mark
#2
Some new diagnostic info -
I ran torque pro on my phone and had it display fuel rail pressure for me. At idle on a warmed up engine it was reading just over 1000 psi. Revving the engine showed the fuel pressure basically following rpm. Around 1700psi at appx 3000 rpm was the peak I saw while revving.
This suggests to me that hpfp is not the cause of my problems. Can someone with more experience weigh in on this?
Also, I cleared codes and drove around a bit. The codes I got back were 300, 302, 303, and 304. Along with the code for limp mode of course
If I'm correct that hpfp has been eliminated, am I back to coils?
I ran torque pro on my phone and had it display fuel rail pressure for me. At idle on a warmed up engine it was reading just over 1000 psi. Revving the engine showed the fuel pressure basically following rpm. Around 1700psi at appx 3000 rpm was the peak I saw while revving.
This suggests to me that hpfp is not the cause of my problems. Can someone with more experience weigh in on this?
Also, I cleared codes and drove around a bit. The codes I got back were 300, 302, 303, and 304. Along with the code for limp mode of course
If I'm correct that hpfp has been eliminated, am I back to coils?
#3
2012 R57 with 81k miles
The other day I went to accelerate hard & all heck broke loose (or didn't - but a cheerful flashing half-engine warning did start flashing.)
I limped home & put my generic code reader on the car -- got a P0300 and P0597. It's had the P0597 for a while; I was being lazy about getting to it since it seems like a pain to replace the whole thermostat housing.
In any case - this car is my wife's & she does lots of very short trips, rarely airs it out, etc. It would not be the first time I've had buildup issues on one of her turbo cars from lack of aggressive driving.
I got serious about trying to diagnose this today. After reading endless posts, I pulled all the coils & visually inspected them. None looked obviously burnt up. I pulled the plugs & they didn't seem remarkable. They were Denso's so they'd been replaced in the past. I put in new NGKs just because it is often recommended. After this I started the car up. Somewhat rough idle, still flashing the half-engine light. Won't rev past 4k. I took it for a drive in 1st gear around the neighborhood to warm it up. It's obviously missing during acceleration & is clearly in limp mode since it loses all power above 4k until it's back below 4k. After getting it up to operating temperature, nothing much was changing. Relatively smooth operation at 3k, missing on acceleration, nothing above 4k.
Got home to a host of codes - P0597, P0300, P0302, P0304, P0303, B2aaa (I guess only cylinder 1 isn't misfiring? Seems odd)
So it's misfiring everywhere it seems. Based on my reading, I'm suspicious of HPFP (ouch, pricey), or it needs all new coils (yay, cheap & easy). Is there anything I can do to pin this down further? I don't want to just randomly replace parts hoping for a miracle. One last weirdness -- the car sat for a week after this happened. When I went out to work on it, the 1.5 yo battery was next to dead -- not enough juice to start. I put it on a charger & haven't had an issue since.
Thanks,
Mark
The other day I went to accelerate hard & all heck broke loose (or didn't - but a cheerful flashing half-engine warning did start flashing.)
I limped home & put my generic code reader on the car -- got a P0300 and P0597. It's had the P0597 for a while; I was being lazy about getting to it since it seems like a pain to replace the whole thermostat housing.
In any case - this car is my wife's & she does lots of very short trips, rarely airs it out, etc. It would not be the first time I've had buildup issues on one of her turbo cars from lack of aggressive driving.
I got serious about trying to diagnose this today. After reading endless posts, I pulled all the coils & visually inspected them. None looked obviously burnt up. I pulled the plugs & they didn't seem remarkable. They were Denso's so they'd been replaced in the past. I put in new NGKs just because it is often recommended. After this I started the car up. Somewhat rough idle, still flashing the half-engine light. Won't rev past 4k. I took it for a drive in 1st gear around the neighborhood to warm it up. It's obviously missing during acceleration & is clearly in limp mode since it loses all power above 4k until it's back below 4k. After getting it up to operating temperature, nothing much was changing. Relatively smooth operation at 3k, missing on acceleration, nothing above 4k.
Got home to a host of codes - P0597, P0300, P0302, P0304, P0303, B2aaa (I guess only cylinder 1 isn't misfiring? Seems odd)
So it's misfiring everywhere it seems. Based on my reading, I'm suspicious of HPFP (ouch, pricey), or it needs all new coils (yay, cheap & easy). Is there anything I can do to pin this down further? I don't want to just randomly replace parts hoping for a miracle. One last weirdness -- the car sat for a week after this happened. When I went out to work on it, the 1.5 yo battery was next to dead -- not enough juice to start. I put it on a charger & haven't had an issue since.
Thanks,
Mark
Stephen
#6
I unplugged each position sensor, inspected the connectors, and reconnected. I did not see any difference in behavior as a result.
For what it’s worth, when the vehicle is idling in the driveway there is a bit of an odor from the tail pipe — smells like fuel not fully burned / overly rich mixture.
For what it’s worth, when the vehicle is idling in the driveway there is a bit of an odor from the tail pipe — smells like fuel not fully burned / overly rich mixture.
#7
Multiple misfires with individual coils like we have point to the sensor which drives the spark. That’s my first task, change the cam sensors. And remotely, the front oxygen sensor can be out of spec enough to cause a fuel issue and occasional misfire without throwing a code specific to the oxygen sensor. So from the top down, cam sensors, oxygen sensor, old plugs, bad tank of gas.
Stephen
Stephen
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#11
Just an update to everyone - I got the cam shaft sensors and put them in. Car started with no CEL posting. Went for a drive, and got a CEL as I accelerated away from the stop sign. Codes 0300 and 0302. After driving around for a while, I was not seeing other cylinders post codes, but 0302 kept coming up. Came home and swapped #1 and #2 coils. Cleared the codes and fired it up again. Revved a few times and CEL was back. But this time, it was reporting 0301 as the misfiring cylinder. In all my testing to date, I have never seen a 0301 code.
So - my conclusion is I have a bad coil. If so, I suppose I should change them all out, vs doing one and then having to do more in a few months. Anyone disagree with this as the next step?
Mark
So - my conclusion is I have a bad coil. If so, I suppose I should change them all out, vs doing one and then having to do more in a few months. Anyone disagree with this as the next step?
Mark
#12
I had same issues before, replaced all 4 coils. Problem went away on first few drives. But then came back again. All I get is random misfire codes between P0301-0304. This went on for a while until I start to see a pattern that on cold startup, this is where the issue occurs. Then when the engine gets warm it stops limping. I does progressive get worse on subsequent days, but only if the engine starts cold. I ended up replacing the HPFP and problem is completely resolved. Out of my ordeal, I got new coils and new HPFP, while I was at it, I pulled the injectors and pressurized them through with carb cleaner. Also did a walnut blast valve cleaning job. Car ended up driving like a champ afterwards.
Last edited by Yupetc; 10-03-2018 at 12:38 PM.
#13
I would go ahead and replace all 4 coils at the same time, they are fairly inexpensive (I suppose, lol). Don’t buy any of the aftermarket ones with claims of performance increase...stick to factory coils, they work the best, speaking from experience on that one! You can look up the part# on realOEM.com and order up the right ones right from Delphi, it’s the same coil without the MINI logo for about half the cost. Just make sure they are the correct part numbers. If that doesn’t fix the issue and you already did the cam sensors, you may need to look closer at the HPFP. But I would start with the coils. Regardless of anything else, it never hurts to have good coils and the car will be happier for it, lol. You changed the plugs already, if I read that correctly, so with new coils, hopefully that will take care of it.
post your results for us
post your results for us
#14
Just an update to everyone - I got the cam shaft sensors and put them in. Car started with no CEL posting. Went for a drive, and got a CEL as I accelerated away from the stop sign. Codes 0300 and 0302. After driving around for a while, I was not seeing other cylinders post codes, but 0302 kept coming up. Came home and swapped #1 and #2 coils. Cleared the codes and fired it up again. Revved a few times and CEL was back. But this time, it was reporting 0301 as the misfiring cylinder. In all my testing to date, I have never seen a 0301 code.
So - my conclusion is I have a bad coil. If so, I suppose I should change them all out, vs doing one and then having to do more in a few months. Anyone disagree with this as the next step?
Mark
So - my conclusion is I have a bad coil. If so, I suppose I should change them all out, vs doing one and then having to do more in a few months. Anyone disagree with this as the next step?
Mark
#15
I replaced the #1 ignition coil (formerly the #2 which I became suspicious of due to 0302 errors & swapped to then see a 0301 as above). Mini started right up silky smooth. Took it for a nice high speed drive and all performed normally with no error codes posted. I'll replace the other 3 as well now that I'm confident of the problem -- since if one went, the others are likely ready to go too.
Thanks for the help all!
Thanks for the help all!
#17
Same here
2011 R57 N18 multiple misfires on paired cylinders 2-3 or 1-4 then limp.
NO OTHER CODES.
Replaced plugs, injectors, walnut blast, coils, Mini dealer, other mechanics.
Timing chain.
Vanos x2. Valve on turbo. Crank position sensor. Valve cover.
NO IMPROVEMENT.
Cam sensor - intake. Nope.
Moved same new cam sensor to exhaust.
Car running like new. 2k miles and counting. Fixed sport mode, too.
NO OTHER CODES.
Replaced plugs, injectors, walnut blast, coils, Mini dealer, other mechanics.
Timing chain.
Vanos x2. Valve on turbo. Crank position sensor. Valve cover.
NO IMPROVEMENT.
Cam sensor - intake. Nope.
Moved same new cam sensor to exhaust.
Car running like new. 2k miles and counting. Fixed sport mode, too.
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