I've had a small problem since I got my car about four months (and 2700 miles) ago, which at first I attributed to the car being new and not having "loosened up" yet. However, it doesn't seem to have diminished at all, and I'm thinking about taking the car in to have it checked out.

Sometimes when I try to go into first gear, the shifter stops firmly at a point that's about halfway between neutral and first gear, before the clutch is capable of engaging the gear. Sometimes I can push it past this point with a bit more pressure, and other times it just won't go, even if I go back to neutral position and try again. The only way to "solve" it is to give the car a little gas while it is in this half-engaged position, and this somehow breaks up the resistance and lets me go into first gear as usual. This doesn't feel like something that's good for the car (seem to grind the clutch just slightly), and has left me sitting at a few green lights with aggravated Boston drivers behind me.

Even when the gearbox is functioning optimally, I can still feel this "notch" position in between neutral and first when I shift into first. The problem doesn't seem to depend on the temperature of the car, or how long it's been running.

Thoughts?

 

My car does the same thing, but it also feels the same for the 1-2 shift. I just attributed it to the Getrag, maybe I should have it looked at since it popped out of second into neutral just yesterday, it could have been my fault for not engaging the gear all the way on a 3-2 downshift.

X2

 

Forgot to clarify that I have the 5-speed, not the Getrag. Although I guess this is a problem that might exist in any new gearbox?

 

Syncro Mesh. Or something like that. That is what I used to call it when I was driving a Honda CRX Si. 1st gear was the only one that did that. Basically is disallowed you to go into first gear from a higher gear. I don't know why it did it other than to keep from revving the engine to high. I almost had to be at a stop to get it into 1st from a higher gear. Maybe still a protection issue in the MC???

 

I've never experienced the problem when dropping into first from a higher gear. Only trying to get into first gear from a dead stop. It doesn't seem like it would be an intentional feature of the car.

I'm always driven manual transmissions, and I'm sure it's nothing that I'm doing wrong to cause this. I won't have a chance to take it in until next weekend (the 8th), but I shouldn't have to drive much, if at all, before then. Hopefully this hasn't done any actual damage yet.

I always wanted a CRX...

 

I have always had the some problem with my MC

 

I've had the same problem...usually solvable by shifting the tranny into some other gear (say 2nd or 3rd), then putting it into 1st.

I haven't noticed this when moving, but then I always double-clutch my downshifts.

 

I think this is completely normal for most cars. All the stick shift cars I´ve had in my life do the same thing, and the only thing you had to do was to engage 2nd and then go back to 1st. Don´t know why but pretty much all manuald cars do it

(Experienced it in a vw golf, a nissan sentra, a mustang, a beetle, a civic and the mini)

 

I also have a 5-speed and have had trouble engaging 1st gear. The bigger problem is getting it into reverse. At times, I have really had to wrestle with the stick to get it into reverse. Has anyone else had similar problems?

 

No, no problems with reverse. All of the other gears besides first are so smooth and easy that this problem really stands out. This is my fourth car, all stickshifts (others were Honda/Toyotas), and I've never had this problem. Then again, I've never owned a car less than 5 years old... I'm still going to have it checked out, as long as it doesn't cost anything.

 

>>I also have a 5-speed and have had trouble engaging 1st gear. The bigger problem is getting it into reverse. At times, I have really had to wrestle with the stick to get it into reverse. Has anyone else had similar problems?

I have experienced it sticking trying to get into first and reverse on every manual transmission I have driven in the last 40 years. Let me know if the geniuses at your MINI dealership have finally found the solution.



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cosmos black, premium, 16" wheels.

 

This is a perfectly normal condition related to synchro-mesh. I realize it can be a pain, but it is a function of the design (on most modern gearbox/transmissions, not just the Cooper). Synchro-mesh, in the simplest of terms, refers to a lightweight ring that has "teeth" on one side and is engaged by friction on the other side. You have the gears, coupling mechanisms for each gear, and then the synchro-mesh ring.

The synchro-mesh teeth connect to the coupler, and the coupler connects to the actual gears. You have to keep in mind that all these rings and gears are flying around at different speeds. There has to be some way of easing these connections together and bringing everything to the same rotational speed without teeth grinding.

If you don't get into a gear before the car comes to a dead stop, the synchro-mesh ring will stop spinning, as well as other parts of the transmission. Then, when you try to engage first from a dead stop, since things are no longer spinning, you will sometimes have teeth that don't line up, and that is when you experience the trouble getting into first. The reason this does not occur in higher gears is because everything is already spinning once you get out of first.

In order to minimize this condition, you should always try to shift into first while the car is still moving. Push in the clutch and go to first just before the car comes to a dead stop. If the push to first is difficult, don't force it. Just keep a slight pressure on the ****, and as the transmission slows, the gear will eventually very easily engage.

If you forget to do this, there is an out. Shift into neutral, let out the clutch. This will spin things up in the transmission. Now, push in the clutch and immediately shift to first.

Hope that helps,
JS

 

Thanks for the answer, folks!!

 

>>Hope that helps,
>>JS

Thanks! Finally I understand what it meant by "synchro mesh". I don't always go into first before coming to a stop, especially in the city. I'll try the technique you mentioned.

 

>>This is a perfectly normal condition related to synchro-mesh. I realize it can be a pain, but it is a function of the design (on most modern gearbox/transmissions, not just the Cooper).

<edited>

>>If you forget to do this, there is an out. Shift into neutral, let out the clutch. This will spin things up in the transmission. Now, push in the clutch and immediately shift to first.
>>
>>Hope that helps,
>>JS
>>

Thanks for that explanation and for the tip. It also explains the difficulty finding reverse sometimes. I never knew why it happened, and had never heard the tip about neutral. Beats the frantic rowing I have always done while holding the clutch in, to find any gear and then returning to first or reverse.


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cosmos black, premium, 16" wheels.

 

:smile:

Cheers!
Clover

 

hi chrisneal

ive expereinced this with my mini MANY times. Im glad youre bringing this up. I took it to my dealer and they checked it out adn said the car was fine so take the advice given from JSTINES ive tried it and it seems to solve the problem.

Since this was my very first manual car i panicked the first time it happened but the car overall seems fine so I wasnt too worried. Hopefully ive saved you a trip to the dealer.

Good luck

 

That doesn't sound right. Mine doesn't do it at all. Even when cold. I've found this transmission to be very smooth. I can see trouble when rolling - when the synchros have to match speeds, but at a stop it shouldn't do that.

I also read that putting it in first before coming to a stop is hard on the synchros and will wear them out prematurely.

My Dad always made me put cars in neutral at a stop and only engage first when you're ready to go. This saves the throwout bearing. He started on crashboxes (no synchros), and raced with them, so he's got some experience to back his claims.

Anyway, I'd have it checked if I were you.

 

Perhaps your father was talking about downshifting to first.

I don't see how shifting to first when the car has almost come to a stop could damage the syncro-mesh ring. I'm not talking about downshifting to first and then letting out the clutch; I'm talking about keeping the clutch in.

Downshifting without first rev-matching is what causes more wear and tear on the synchro, because then the synchro must do more work.

Here is a link I think everyone might find useful:

http://happytogether.com/318ti/notebook/shifting/

It covers shifting to first, shifting into reverse, as well as downshifting, rev matching, and heal and toe technique. It's very well written.

See ya,
JS

 

No,no,no. You shouldn't need to force, coerce, jimmy or fiddle your way from first to second. Something is wrong with the tranny if it is doing anything but shifting smoothly. Loads of advice regarding double clutching, pausing in neutral, etc. is nice but if you have to do those things it means there is something wrong with your car. Let's use this example: if the automotive mags were testing the MINI and doing 0-60 mph tests do you think they would think it was normal to have to coerce it from 1st to 2nd or slip it into neutral, double clutch and then hit 2nd? Can't imagine what the write-up would look like!
Bottom line is this isn't correct, it needs to be fixed.
Good luck.
ps. Chris, how's the new air filter feel? Any difference?

 

Steve, first to second is no problem at all, just going from neutral to first at a dead stop. Perhaps you're responding to someone else's problem here?

Can't say I actually feel any noticeable difference with the Moss intake. It definitely sounds nice, though. I'm not sure I'd be able to feel 4 hp anyway!

 

Well I'll be go to hell! Why didn't I process it the way I read it? Ok, so I'm off base on your problem, but i"m sure my explanation will fit somewhere someday. Still, I feel the same way that it won't slip in from neutral to first. It should go smooth like bread and butter, gin and tonic, fat and sexy (well, only in some circles ). If you need to coax it or get the rpms up to make it mesh it ain't working right.

 

Yeah, open your ears! Cripes...

It looks like it won't happen this weekend either, but I do plan to take the car in to check this out, even if just to ease my mind. I'll be sure to post an update at that time. Thanks all for the help.

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2003 Red/White Cooper - Brookline, MA