My oil analysis was returned this weekend! Please visit my updated page for the results.

The oil used was Amsoil 0W-30. The oil was added in November and I intend to run it for the entire year or to 35,000 miles which ever comes first. The tests show why our product is the only one to be back with a guarantee. I encourage to also read the Corporate Update found in my News section.

You will see the viscosity index is right where it needs to be for a "30 weight" oil. Also as long as the TBN is above 7 and calcium levels remain high the oil will continue to neutralize acids.Analysis Results
Corporate Update

 

I am impressed with the data, how come I have heard so little of Amsoil in the past?
Are they not nationally distributed like "the competition"? And is this why you are to our rescue? :smile:

Cheers,
Ryan

 

Amsoil, is the first and still the best sythetic available.
The reason you have not heard much is because Amsoil spends allot of money on production and very little in marketing.

Yo ZAP

Hands down you have the best sig on this board

S R B

 

Hello Ryan,
Thanks for your nice comments! The answer to your questions just depends on your level of exposure. The main reason it's just now gaining popularity is simply because of the recent acceptance of synthetics. Amsoil's popularity for years was primarily in the northern states and with OTR truck owners. Also our 2-cycle, snowmobile and motorcycle oils have become a household name thanks to the winning racing sponsorships such as Honda's Mike LaRocco and Travis Preston.
Today you will find our products in a growing # of lube centers, service stations coast to coast. You won't find Amsoil in large retail centers because the retail outlet wants to under cut the dealers which Amsoil is committed not to let that happen.

 

Thanks for the feedback Zappa! You'll probley be hearing from my wallet in the future

 

I forget the rules about this, so perhaps as a courtesy to the other members, if you are talking about a product you rep in any way, could you include this in your sig? Regardless of what whomever the powers-that-be think, it would probably be better salesmanship to also add the disclaimer more prominently. The plural possessive (our product) just makes me think of bad Amway jokes. Simply stating 'I am a sales rep' stikes me as more reputable.

 

In Zappa's defense - he is an MCO sponsor and he has been a regular poster about his products - he probably has had little reason to think that people aren't aware that he is an Amsoil vendor. As a matter of fact, at some point in the past someone jumped all over his back for being TOO foward about mentioning his products. Give him a break! He's providing infomation on how his product performs specifically in relation to MINIs (HIS MINI) - not just a hokey sales pitch.

On the Other hand, to some extent I can see username's point. New and infrequent posters may not be aware. From this single post, it isn't exactly clear....

Zappa, maybe just adding a couple words to your sig would clear this up? Maybe saying something like "For more info check out http://www.syntheticwarehouse.com" ???

You know how it goes: You can please some of the people all the time and all the people some of the time - but not all of the people all of the time.

 

Thanks Mini2Go! You have a LOT of class! Actually we are moving this to the Vendor Announcement area here in a bit. I posted it here earlier - as a technical difficulty inadvertently delayed my post so when Nick posted that comment he spoke too soon. Yes I agree I should note a disclaimer on there. I am not a sales rep but owner/dealer so how does "Featuring Amsoil Products" sound?

_________________

</p>
<a href="http://www.syntheticwarehouse.com">The Synthetic Warehouse</a>

 

how does "Featuring Amsoil Products" sound?

I think it works! :smile:

 

I thought my comment was straddling the line between a complaint and trying to be helpful. I just had lots of problems with my oil pressure, and it was ostensibly all mechanical. But I have been reading any thread about oil. I am not entirely dismissive of frustrated by the amount of information provided here about Amsoil vs Mobil 1 vs castrol. I am an admitted neophyte to all of this.

My point was that when I see testimonials, I am always skeptical, unless they are from sources where I understand the process of aggregating information (the Consumers Union, for instance, whether you think they are good or not, you can assess their methodology somewhat). When I come to understand that a testimonial is from a source with a vested finanical interest, my skeptic meter goes through the roof, and interest through the floor.

You can blame PT Barnum and snake oil salesmen from the last century, but any marketing person will tell you, testimonials are effective, but they are not necessarily honest or accurate. I would hazard that the skepticism level is high with people who buy premuim brands (and MINI is a premium brand, no matter how you slice it). But if you think your way is better, more honest and within the MCO posting rules, then fine. I'm just letting you know as a half interested potential consumer, I find the way this info is posted to have an tinge of dissembling. Not a lot, but enough to diminish my interest. Enough to say I would rather go with Mobil 1 until I find a reputable independent source of assessment.

 

Hey Zappa,

How about putting your disclaimer where you now have that picture of that scary, scary man?

 

I completely understand!! I am only a dealer because I was impressed myself. I get your concerns all the time but once you understand the legacy of Amsoil, it all comes together. All I can say to that is just try it your self. You don't last 30 years in this market with false claims.

I would be more than glad to pull an analysis on any Mobil 1 user at my mileage and beyond at my cost.

Also do some research on Mobil 1. Ask why their regular line oil does not meet CH-4 and will it ever meet Ci-4 where Amsoil makes products that do. Amsoil is more than Motor Oil. And we beat the price on Marine and gear products.

Here is a statement from Al Amatuzio that explains it pretty well.

"As most of you are aware. Mobil 1was introduced after AMSOIL had paved the way for synthetic motor oils back in the '70's. When it was introduced it cased great concern among many of our Dealers. But in my Presidents Message at the time, I assured everyone that having Mobil 1 on the market would only help us sell more oil. Mobil confirmed everything we had been saying about synthetic oils, and our products and claims instantly became more credible.

Since then, we have always been compared to Mobil 1. When people think of synthetic motor oil, they think of AMSOIL and Mobil 1, not the other Johnny-come-lately's that have come on the market more recently. I have always said that Mobil 1 is a good motor oil, because compared to the run-of-the-mill motor oils on the market, it is. I have also always said that AMSOIL motor oil is better, again, because it is. Mobil makes their oils to run at normal drain intervals while we make ours for extended drain intervals, and therein lies the difference. Their oils don't have to be as good as ours, so they are not.

To prove that point, we ran a number of comparative tests on our 5W-30 and Mobil 1 SuperSyn 5W-30. The test results are published in this Action News, and they confirm what I have been saying all along. AMSOIL makes a better motor oil.

These test results show significant differences between the oils. Look at the results of the NOACK Volatility Test. Which oil is going to last longer in service? Look at the difference in Total Base Numbers. Again, which oil is going to provide the longest lasting protection? Look at the Four Ball Wear Test. Which oil will protect against engine wear better? In every category we tested, AMSOIL proved superior. Lower pour point, higher flash and fire points, AMSOIL tested best.

So when I hear claims that nothing outperforms Mobil 1, I have to say "wrong!". They may have good slogans and marketing hype, but when it comes to superior performance, I say nothing beats AMSOIL!"


And you don't have to believe the tests, just look at the published data sheets then take the oil to a reputable analysis jobber and you will see that the TBN is elevated, the volitility holds true (Amsoil was the first to publish NOACK results before the tests were required by the API) and after so many miles compare the viscosity index between the two. 75% of my customers are in your part of the country (NY and NJ)so just ask around. I'm tellin you. With our 0W30 at least you will feel the difference.

One service dealers provide to our fleet diesel customers are solutions to reduce operating costs. I have volumes of data and programs right here in my office to do so. You will not find this service with any other. I go out on a limb for all my customers. I make sure they are satisfied with their order and provide anyone that requests a catalog actual industry data.

I also have a club fundraising program for non-profit organizations. I make no retail profit on these programs. Anyone who orders from the retail catalogs from that "Club" account, Amsoil will send the club a check every month. If that club moved 50 cases of oil in one month they would recieve a check for around $1080.00.

I can also sponsor any MINI race team at 1/2 the cost of the oil...

I am here for you. I love this group and enjoy the friends I have made here since July.
:smile:


_________________

</p>
<a href="http://www.syntheticwarehouse.com">The Synthetic Warehouse - We feature Amsoil Product

 

I know I have to earn your business and just thought I would post a typical transaction. The names have been changed... Start with the bottom and work your way up of the post..

End of text starts here:

You certainly may do that, with the new HD SE Syn at $8.25, Mobil 1 at
$6.99-$7.99, and with Amsoil's rep. why would anyone not be interested.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ches Cain" <mellotron@sbcglobal.net>
To: "Benny Chennult [mailto:bnbgbles@link.net]>
Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 10:18 PM
Subject: RE: Amsoil


> Thank you!!
> BTW, I am making a customer satisfaction page and is it ok if I use your
> quote with your name?
> Ches
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Benny Chennult [mailto:bnbgbles@link.net]
> Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 5:34 PM
> To: mellotron@sbcglobal.net
> Subject: Re: Amsoil
>
>
> Mr. Cain,
> Received the order today. You have a great product at a great price. You
> can count on my business and my referral to others. Thanks also for the
> great service.
>
> Benny Chennult

[mailto:bnbgbles@link.net]> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ches Cain" <mellotron@sbcglobal.net>
> To: <jnbgables@earthlink.net>
> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 10:40 PM
> Subject: Amsoil
>
>
> >
> > Sir,
> > I just wanted to let you know your order was received, filed and sent
this
> > morning.
> > It should be there by Wednesday of next week.
> > Thank you,
> > Ches Cain
> >
> > http://www.syntheticwarehouse.com
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>


Ches Cain - KB5ZAU 80 meter talk
_________________

</p>
<a href="http://www.syntheticwarehouse.com">The Synthetic Warehouse - We feature Amsoil Products</a>

 

I got an Amsoil Oil Change from my local gas station in St. Pete. I was going to order from Zappa, and do my 18K with Amsoil. Low and behold their was amsoil on the shelf ! Fill 'er up please. Bob Lee's St. Pete FL.

BTW... My MCS has noisy BMW sounding valves with Mobil-1 and castrol from the dealer. The Amsoil has muted that sound and the power feels more silky than before. Just my imagination, maybe.

I like the product and I would buy it again.

Kesh420
EB/W MCS 16,900mi

 

Yucca's MINI will run on Zappa's Amsoil.

period.

(as soon as I do my first oil change in a couple weeks)

 

>>I am impressed with the data, how come I have heard so little of Amsoil in the past?
>>Are they not nationally distributed like "the competition"? And is this why you are to our rescue? :smile:
>>
>>Cheers,
>>Ryan

Actually they are nationally distrubuted, just not in every store like Mobil and other big oil companies. The ACE auto parts down the street from me even sells it.

 

Hi guys. I did not come here to bust anyone or any product but key to being a knowledgable consumer is knowing the facts. The 4 ball test and even the much tougher Fallen V Block tests does not define a good oil in operation in a motor. A play of comparisons of a group IV based oil vs lower groups like the Syntec and it's primary group III dino now allowed to be called a synthetic only in the USA does not verify what will work best for you and your driving.

Noack tests like the DIN 51581 is not as tough as the near brutal ASTM 5800 and there are two 4 ball tests although again imo meaningless to how an oil actually does in a motor. Look closely at these 4 ball tests performed by this company,they use two and it makes the oils in the line look very simalar, Some of the most recent tests I have seen have been compared to oils that simply do not exist anylonger and have been upgrades immensly in performance.
I came here to learn more about the Cooper and while here I would like to help educate those with( open minds ) to the merits of such tests and comparisons and debunk some old wives tales and imo extra ordinary wild claims. The topic oil will be discussed in lenght later if anyone's interested,,anyoil for that matter

Any questions just fire away but please keep them short and to the point so I can help fully one by one. I have many analysis's here to show you how motors react to oil and combustion particulate contaminates espesially with higher mile motors that make excessive long intervals impossible in some older motors or those that are hard on a oil by virtue of how it's driven and crankcase capacity,emissions equipment to include actual cam timing which can super heat the exhaust valve area if the exhaust lobe center angle is 118 or higher.

As time goes by I will post links for those that are interested in learning more about motor oils and their additive packs and the roles the individual additives can play in formulation. What separates some form the others ect,

Questions ? I will be happy to help :smile:

BTW,Calcium comes in many forms,the newer sulphonates can act as AW's and FM's and do not neutralise sulphuric acid in the engine oil in whole.Corrosion and Rust inhibitors such as metal phenolates, fatty acids and amines and some others do this job in formulation and some help comes from the sulphonates. Tmes they are a changing,there are many multi functional additive in formulation these days. Oils are better than ever,,now they need to give us some better engines to use them in imo !

_________________
Lifes Good!

 

I am not entirely dismissive of frustrated by the amount of information provided here about Amsoil vs Mobil 1 vs castrol. I am an admitted neophyte to all of this.
>>

I could not locate any postings with questions along this line,,,pleae post these questions and I will try to help you understand the diferences in these oils

 

Curtis: You seem to know quite a bit about oil. I have always been curious about the differences, but when I try to start reading about this I am always inundated with terminology that I've never heard before and it is never defined. I would love to ask meaningful questions, but I simply don't know enough to be able to formulate one.

If there is anything that I would ask anyone about oil it would first be for a glossary of terms and then a "101" type run-down of some of the primary concepts in oil formulation, use, and degradation including what is tested, how it's tested, and why testing certain things is important.

Another thing that has puzzled me is why, in this age of the informed consumer, is this industry still shrouded in mystery to the general population? There seems to be no truly independent, reliable, widely accessible information source on anything related to oil products (including oil filters). Maybe I'm just looking in the wrong places.

That's probably too much stuff to ask.

PS. I saw in another thread you said that you do not sell oil and are not affiliated with any oil companies. Do you mind if I ask how you have come to know so much about oil?

BTW, Welcome to MCO!

 

Mini2Go
Thanks for the welcome. To answer your question after 30 years of racing and building race motors with 5k dollar crankshafts ect a guy kinda needs to know how oils differentiate from others,,one cannot take what he is told on the telephone at face value imo,it's anything for a buck so it seems. Another thing it's in my genes,he he. I grew up playing with lubes,mixing this and that together,plus I'm a information freak,man it's lunch time start here at http://www.lubrizol.com . They make all the additives that is purchased by and goes into Amsoils formulated oils for example and many,many others oils,lubes and fuels.They are an Industry giant. Amsoil purchases it's base stocks from Exxon/Mobil. Exxon/Mobil makes all their additives in house.

I will post some other links and info on Redline,Royal Purple and others later later,this will keep you busy for awhile :smile:

here is a link to ACEA Specs, http://www.acea.be/ACEA/20020618Publ...lSequences.pdf


_________________
Lifes Good!

 

What Curtis says is somewhat and while he is right that the comparisons using their type IV to a type III may be misleading, Amsoil knows the general public is interested how it compares to the motor oils sold on most shelves. This is not the case with the 0W-30. It is tested against the Mobil 1 product. The Amsoil Series 7500 is the only API certified type III with a 7500 mile guarantee.

And like he said the ASTM D-5800 Noack Volatility test is tough - most AMSOIL motor oils are tested using this procedure including the popular 5W-30, 15W-40 HIGH TBN Diesel/Marine, and the 10W-30. It's published.

The best thing about Amsoil is during business hours you can talk to their technical services department on the phone. Ask them the toughest questions.. So much changes all the time that I have to call frequently myself.
I also must point out in the last 6 months they have been upgrading their equipment and new lab facility with their expansion. They constantly search for the best chemists, education and adhere to quality controls to the nth degree.
Sometime within the next 3 months I am atteding one of the CAT schools they put on and will take many of these concerns directly to the head of the staff - Dave Anderson. In July they are having a convention and open house for the new lab facility. I hope to go but can't say yet..

You also know I have been here supporting MCO for some time, prize giveaways and top customer service. I have only exceptionally positive responses back form the dozens of customers I have earned on MCO and those whom have used Amsoil in their families for decades.

In order to make a oil that is designed for convenience and longetivity certain mixtures and limits on additives such as phosphorous are needed to reduce the degradation of catalytic converters. Control on anti-foaming (including gear lubes), neutralizing acids and soot in new diesel engines with EGR valves (which the API has new stringent requirements - and Amsoil is one of the few to already comply), keep wear metals in suspension, reducing emissions, sheer stability and to keep the viscosity index tight w/o too many VII (index improvers and polymers that cause oils to sheer) are many items the chemist must work around to have a good end product. It's not as simple as base stocks as it is how they are used and Amsoil is constantly reviewing suppliers. It is not a fact that they buy all from one company but they are pleased with lubrizol and have been for years.

Anyone who has asked for a catalog from me knows I include copies of various Amsoil Service Line updateds to include the one on the phosphorous concern and the new GF-4 requirements that will be hitting the shelves in the spring of 2004. (Passenger car motor oils must pass the GF-3 Sequence IIIG test now. GF-4 requires the IIIF) I'll send this to anyone who wants it.. These tests are only performed on certified engines and the new modification involves cam lobe wear and backward compatability.

Stefan Korcez, Ford's Research Lab - "We would have liked more participation by the oil companies right from the beginning to show what new technology is capable of doing, we didn't get that from the oil companies for GF-3."

(polymers are the additives used in multi-weight oils to allow them to adjust to different temps. thus a 10W40 has a high degree of them but if you notice today several manufactures are threatining voiding warranties if 10W-40s are used because these additives are not lubricants and deminish the oils ability to protect. AMSOIL can formulate their 10W-30 and 15W-40 with no viscosity index improvers but uses some in the 10W-40 and 5W-30.) this is why I recommend staying away from additives and long term use of racing oils that advertise "friction reducing polymers"

-As for the 4-ball wear tests, I would never use that to judge a product by its self nor would I expect anyone else to, but the most recient data sheets printed which I send out do have the latest brands including Mobil 1. I tell everyone to judge the product simply by their own use or others experiences.

Extended oil changes are not "Wild Claims" as was remarked elsewhere. I have tons of actual cost and vehicle savings from fleets coast to coast noting their overall impressions to include the reduction of wear metals in one large trucking firm that were documented over time. Customer Floyd Erks of Linclon Nebraska who has over 750,000 miles on his Areo Star van he uses for courier service. Floyd uses the 0W-30 at 35,000 mile guaranteed intervals and SDF oil filters according to service recommendations. Our ATF is guaranteed for three times longer and Eaton Transmissions EXTENDS warranties when our product is used. Amsoil is now one of the recommended products for American LaFrance fire trucks.

Extended intervals have been used in the fleet industry for years and the benifits are now reversing the brainwashing out in the general population. I would recommend reading the two page article in the industry magazine, "Lubes and Greases" this month which features Amsoil contributions and solutions. Totally third party.

As for higher mileage engines or racing applications Amsoil's warranty is clearly stated in my "Product Info" area on my site. For example should the oil become unduly contaminated by improper or irregular servicing or deficiencies within the equipment in which it has been installed the extended service coverage does not apply. Like all other oils - racing included. But analysis is always suggested and of every analysis I have seen out here in the field but one (due to contamination of the sample) has suggested a higher mileage engine or heat stressed one will benefit from a high quality synthetic. There is a Corvair Dune Buggy customer that had very pleasing results with our product..
If a motor is "hard on oil" it's generally not in sound condition. Also I suggest high capacity sumps to use an alternative filtering device to solve that problem such as a proven by-pass filtration system.

There is a new book coming out soon from a lubricant engineer and current Ford Powertrain director (Dave Mann) whom I have talked with directly on this subject. The book is being reviewed for the final time and I will be getting one of the first ones and making the information available for everyone who needs it. I'm hoping he will authorize me to make sample copies of pages regarding "combinations" to include with my catalog requests..

Mike McMillan, General Motors Manager of Engine Oils

"The current system discourages incentives for quality upgrades. We have only a single specification now. Why should any oil company take that extra step to create a product that is significantly above the minimum spec without any way to identify it and get paid additional for it?"
This is what Amsoil has been able to do for 30 years and the industry knows it.

Danny Larkin, Detroit Diesel Chemist

"Engine technology has advanced tremendously in the last few years. But oil technology has not kept up."

_________________

</p>
<a href="http://www.syntheticwarehouse.com">The Synthetic Warehouse - We feature Amsoil Product