I have driven my new 2010 for about 1500 miles now. It has stock struts/shocks with 16" factory wheels and stock Continentals. I have added a Hotchkiss rear bar, TSW chassis brace and NM lower motor mount stiffener. It has .8 degrees of negative camber in front, 1.5 degrees of negative in the rear and about 1/16" of toe, front and rear. I have an M7 strut bar and plates on the way, but not installed, yet. I am generally very happy with the ride/handling.

The problem, though, is that the front suspension violently bottoms out in places that no other vehicle I know of does. I drive many different cars and trucks on the same routes everyday and the Mini bottoms out in places one would never guess would cause this.

I know these cars have limited bump travel, so the options would be:

1. Longer, more progressive celastos
2. Stiffer springs
3. Struts with more bump damping

I know most people are interested in lowering their cars (I'm not), but has anyone tried something to reduce the violence of the bottoming?

Thanks,

DOC

 

What kind of *places*? My '08 Justa has 32,000 miles on it and it has never bottomed out. Anywhere. No suspension mods on mine. Yet.

 

i.e. it "finds" potholes that no other vehicles do. It is obvious why "mushrooming" the strut mounts is such an issue and why so many people add "stiffeners" to strengthen them.

What do people think about just adding HD Bilsteins in the front?

([FONT=Arial]VE3-D936-H0 and VE3-D937-H0) Do these come with different celastos to replace (or supplement) OEM?[/FONT]
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[FONT=Arial]Thanks,[/FONT]
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[FONT=Arial]DOC [/FONT]

 

What's with all the "font" stuff on my last post?

DOC

 

Not sure about the font stuff...

I think you do feel even small potholes more in a MINI than other vehicles. It's part of the fun.

It looks like you're also running the run-flat tires - the quickest way to get a more comfortable ride is to delete those now. You will notice an improvement in the ride immediately. I run my stock run-flats/wheels in the winter and I can't wait to wear the tread right off so I never have to own run flats again.

Of course, that doesn't explain your bottoming out issue. Someone better than me will have to weigh in on that.

 

No runflats. I've been building/racing Formula Fords for 40 years, so my experience is not insignificant. This is a problem that needs to be addressed and is definitely not "part of the enjoyment".

DOC

 

What kind of stock 16" non-runflat Continentals do you have?

I believe the mushrooming problem was limited to 1st gen cars.

 

195-55-R16-87R Continental Contact SSR

33 psi front/31 psi (cold) rear gives even tire temps between the center and outside shoulder. They run about 5 degrees hotter on the inside due to negative camber.

DOC

 

SSR = Self Supporting Runflat

 

Thanks! I told the salesperson I did not want runflats and they assured me that the "base" Cooper did not come with them. The fact that it came with a spare and the fact that the Cooper S does not have a spare and consequently comes with runflats made me not question anything about this. (The demo I drove had different tires. The car I wanted had to be acquired from a dealer in NY. Never considered it could have come with runflats.)

This has nothing to do with the bottoming problem, though, but now I can look forward to improved ride quality when I get my new tires. What would you suggest for all season, street only use? I have a STRONG bias towards sticky tires with big grooves in them (anti-hydroplaning) that don't last too long.

How about Falken ZE-912s? I've run ZE-512s for 6 years on my Passat and been very happy, but they don't make 512s in 195-55-16.

Thanks again,

DOC

 

Doc,

Do you want to stay with all seasons non RFT? Alex from tirerack has recommended Yokohama Envigors or Continental DWS when I was looking.

Not to hijack the thread, how do you like your x-brace?

 

I like the TSW X-brace. There was a distinct increase in how solid the car felt over rougher pavement as soon as I added it. I don't drive around on the door handles enough to comment on handling effects.

On tires, I am leaning towards the Yoko ENVigors, but want to hear from more people on this site.

Thanks,

DOC

 

That is good to hear. I was one of the few with a R56 that has reported a stiffer chassis with my M7 USS only to be polked at by some who think that the car is already too stiff for anything to work.

You can call alex at tirerack.com ext 294 to discuss your options with him. He specializes in Minis, is part of this forum and will know a whole bunch.

 

BTW,

The Conti DWS looks like it is only Z-rated and I don't see it in 195-55-16. I prefer an H-rated tire for ride comfort and lower cost. (If I drive over 85 MPH on the street, I need to be shot.)

DOC

 

You could do 205 50 16 as well. Some go with 205 55 16 which is taller but still fits.

 

Since stock MINI's do not bottom out, wonder if all your mods are causing it....

How much do the driver, passengers and cargo weigh when you bottom out?

 

MCS,

So you think there is something wrong with the front struts on my Justa?

It does it with just me (160 lbs) in the driver's seat and 20 lbs in the boot. There no signs of either front strut leaking. However, there looks like there is VERY little bump travel before you hit the celastos, so I am not really surprised there is a problem.

I'm just looking for the "fix". These cars have been out since '07, so there should be a good bit of experience by now.

I now realize I have run-flat tires which I did not want and was told by the salesperson I would not get. However, they only make the "crash" more violent. They don't create it.

So, do I need stiffer springs, shocks with more bump damping, more progressive celastos, a combo or???

Thanks,

DOC

 

I would take off the aftermarket suspension stuff, and if it still bottoms out - take it to the dealer.

 

To clarify, the "mods" have had no effect on the bottoming problem.

The stiffer Hotchkiss rear anti-roll bar, TSW X-Brace and NM lower motor mount stiffener have only been the car for the last 300 miles and the bottoming is no better or worse since I took delivery 1500 miles ago.

If the struts showed signs of leaking or a spring looked broken, I would definitely head to the dealer for a warranty repair.

However, I suspect there is some useful experience out there in the Mini community that should help to shed light on ths issue. A NAM member referred me to Bavarian Auto in NH. I plan to check in with them tomorrow.

Thanks,

DOC

 

The MINI essentially sits on the bumpstops at static ride height if you had a big breakfast. On top of the limited travel, I think the standard dampers have too much rebound, very little compression, and coupled with soft springs it just kinda sucks all around. Then add runflats and heavy wheels....it's not a "sporty" ride like the salesman says, it just sucks. The handling suffers from the limited travel and poor damping too. Cornering on the bumpstops gives it a sporty feel for most people with a safe amount of understeer for the general public and it seems many expect that kind of crappy ride for their sporty car even though it's not necessary.

The Bilstein HDs seem like a very good upgrade from what I've read and in my experience with other cars. Probably a little more travel with the inverted front and internal bumpstop, MUCH better damping, and a little gas pressure. They are also extremely cheap. For your uses I think they would be great. I really really like them for other cars and others on here really really like them for the MCS.

Unfortunately most aftermarket springs for this car lower too much, so I would stick with stock or Cooper S springs (if there is a difference).

- Andrew

 

dbl post. come on!

 

You two are the first I've read to complain about bottoming out of the suspension on a Justa Cooper, but if I had to offer an opinion, I'd contact some of the vendors here on the forum who specialize in race cars and/or high performance underpinnings - they'll probably have some good suggestions. Stiffer springs and shocks seems like the right direction to go as long as you don't mind the harder ride.....

In all of the Coopers - both S and Justa - I've driven over the last 5 years, I can't ever remember bottoming out the suspension - and we've got our share of lousy roads here.

I would try the new tires first, then see what you think. With 40 years of experience building FF's , I'd think you'd already have some good suspension contacts, referrals or ideas on how to cure your issue, but I'd still ask the experts, like Way.

 

I bottom out my suspension almost every day on my R53.

I think "bottoming out" can be deceptive. It happens. There's like 2 inches of travel and progressive bumpstop that you're almost always in contact with.

- Andrew

 

I'm not disputing your word, it's just not happened to me, either in my '03 JCW, my '09 Clubby or any of the loaners I've driven.....that's all I'm saying.

 

To clarify, the most irritating part is single wheel bottoming. It really does take a pretty serious whallop to bottom both front wheels together, simultaneously. However, seemingly insignificant little dips will bottom one side with a resounding crash.

Bilstein HDs have just arrived. Hope to install (with m-7 plates) and align on Friday. Price from Bavarian Autosport is less than most other dealers' claimed cost.

Bilstein NA said 20% more bump damping than OEM and possibly slightly more travel. Hopefully the internal bumpstops will be a bit more progressive. Don't know that I would say OEM has too much rebound on my Justa. I think the same rebound and more bump would suit me. I have not experienced any obvious "jacking down", but there is so little bump travel, who knows?

Let you know.........

DOC