Hi everyone,

Currently I have the stock 15 inch tires (175/65/R15) and wheel on a MCC. I realize most people reading this probably have 16+ inch but new wheels are too expensive. Does anyone have any suggestions of what set of replacement tires I should get that would improve grip and performance without being overly expensive?

I've briefly looked ol and found a very limited selection:Pirelli P3000E, Continental ContiProContact, and EcoContact 2 or 3(the one I currently have). I've also heard that it is possible to get a wider tread such as 195/55R15 or fit different sizes on so there is more of a selection. What is the positive/negative outcome of widening the tread relative to the tire?

-Thanx

 

nothing wrong with 15's. I plan to replace my stock MCS 16's with 15's soon. Small & light!

I am looking at the Falken Ziex ZE 512. I have read some good things about them here, as well as on miata.net (a good place to research smaller size tires). Edge racing sells them, and they are resonable priced.

For the size, what you are looking at doing is typically called "plus 0" sizing - wider tire, smaller sidewall on the same sized rim. Gets a little more meat on the ground, shoudl not be any negative results. Just need to make sure that the size you go to can fit on the rim width that you have.

Here is a great tire calculator:
http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html

good luck!

-jac

 

Stock 175/65-15 tires are narrow and lightweight but don't offer as much performance as wider tires in various sizes up to about 205/55-15. You want to keep the stock outer tire diameter of about 24.4" when possible to keep the speedometer and odometer readings accurate or close enough.

Do a search in the Tires forum for 205/55-15 and you will get threads like:
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ad.php?t=99258
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...d.php?t=102177

In another thread MINIAC posted:
The overall diameter of replacement tire should be within ±3% of OEM tire:

205/50-15 = 23.1" = -3.7%
195/55-15 = 23.4" = -2.1%
205/55-15 = 23.9" = -0.3%
175/65-15 = 24.0" = OEM
195/60-15 = 24.2" = +1.1%
---------------------

The first number is the width of the tread in mm, the 2 digit number after the slash is the sidewall profile where 65 is a higher more comfortable and less stiff sidewall good for daily use while 50 is a shorter stiffer sidewall more suited for performance. 55 series sidewall is in between and offers a bit of both.
I would recommend 205/55-15 but as you can see below some tires are very limited in sizes that will fit the stock MINI 15" rim so you can choose the tire that works for your use and get a size that will fit. For more info talk to or email Alex@tirerack.com

Some examples for stock 15" rims on an MCC.

For 15" MINI wheels
In 195/60-15 in Ultra High Perf All Season class
Bridgestone Potenza RE960AS $68 400 treadwear H speed rated
21 pounds 24.2" outer tire diameter
Kumho Ecsta ASX $45 420 treadwear V speed rated
19 pounds 24.2" outer tire diameter

In 205/55-15 Grand Touring All Season
Bridgestone Turanza LS-V $125 closeout price 400 treadwear V speed rated
23 lbs, 24" outer tire diameter.
Test Results


Also in the same class (with many sizes for 15" and 16")
see survey results-

Check out the Goodyear Eagle ResponsEdge
195/55-15 $113 440 treadwear V speed rated 22 lbs 23.4" tire diam
195/60-15 $95 440 treadwear H speed rated 23 lbs 24.2" tire diam
205/60-15 $98 440 treadwear H speed rated 23 lbs 24.7" tire diam $95 440 treadwear H speed rated
23 lbs, 24.2" outer tire diameter.

---------
The stock Continental ContitouringContact CH95 is a good example of a basic Grand Touring All Season OEM tire. For the MINI it comes in 175/65-15 for $66 each at tirerack. 360 treadwear H speed rated. 16 lbs.

From tirerack tests-

It provides a quiet and comfortable ride.
I really suffers on the track compared to other tires in it's class and does even worse in the wet. It had good braking distance in the dry, not as good in the wet.

I use it for my daily driver tires and find it to be very comfortable even with a suspension tuned for autocross and performance. When I put on 17x7 rims and 215/45-17 tires the ride quality goes way down but performance on turns goes way up.

It's very easy to drive a MINI at the performance limits of a ContiTouringContact tire. In fact it's a little dangerous to drive hard with them, you have to slow down a bit and read the tires. I've used them for some twisty road driving with a MINI group and I did OK but I was lagging far behind partly on purpose.

 

Sorry to bust in here, but what tires in any of those sizes have been found to be best in terms of raw handling?

I don't care about all season tires, or even much about wet performance. We're having a drought here in Los Angeles and then there's the whole global warming thing.

I just want the best combo of handling and smoothness.

Any ideas??

Thanks to all...

 

What rims do you have?
What suspension do you have?
What is your budget for tires?

When in doubt, check out Goodyear eagle F1 GS-D3.
See if you can find a tire that fits your MINI
http://www.tirerack.com/a.jsp?a=EZ3&url=/tires/Spec.jsp&make=Goodyear&model=Eagle+F1+GS-D3&tirePageLocQty=

 

The stock 5.5" rims that have the 175/65/R15s on them.

I am thinking 205/55s.

Thoughts?

Experiences?

No budget issues on a set of street tires.

I'm happy to spend if they handle well.

Thanks.

 

OK, you're like me. Give me the best darn tire. Let me enjoy them.

So for stock 15x5.5" rims-

Max Performance Summer tires no tires in 205/50-15 or 205/55-15
But in 195/50-15
Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3 $93 on back order at tirerack.com
280 Treadwear 82 Load rating (lower than stock), 19 lbs 22.7" outer tire diameter (less than stock), V speed rated

In ultra HP Summer tires in 205/50-15 or 205/55-15
Best overall tire is likely
Michelin Pilot Exalto PE2 $115-116
Even comes in 195/55-15 $109
240 treadwear 18-20 lbs
and another good performance tire (for dry)
BF Goodrich g-Force KDW2 205/50 and 205/55-15 $99 and 107
300 treadwear W speed rated 21 to 22 lbs

Note that most tires that offer better handling can be noisy and less comfortable for daily driving.

 

You should never use a tire that is more than 25-35mm wider than your rims, i.e. a 175 wide tire is at the limit on a MINI 5-1/2" rim.

Wider than that will overheat at speed because of excessive sidewall flexing, and can roll off the rim when cornering because the sidewall is unsupported.

You won't get any better performance with a 205 on a 5-1/2" wheel anyway, because the wheel will be wobbling around between the limits of the too-wide tire tread.

TireRack will not sell you a 205 tire for a 5-1/2" rim - Try reading the material available at their web site.

Save your pennies and wait until you can buy some wider used wheels, don't waste it on tires that just don't fit.

 

You know, I always thought so as well. But on my 1997 BMW 318 Ti the sticky stuff actually were the most quiet, too. Got me spoiled...

I'm figuring I'll over inflate the shorter tire a touch for both the sake of handling and also to minimize the difference in tire height.

Are the Goodrichs really that good?

I'm ready to pull the trigger and looking forward to some better stick!

Thanks again!

 

For 205/50-15 or 205/55-15 tires on stock MINI 15x5.5" rims
see

Under Rim Width range
According to the manufactorer, these wider than stock tires fit rims from 5.5" to 7.5" wide.

So the stock 15" rim is within the design limits of these tires which do work and do fit the rims. I've been running on stock 15" rims in these sizes for daily driving and performance driving (track, lapping, driving school, autocross) for 3 years.

For more information contact Alex@tirerack.com.

 

Wait just a bit and a 195/50-15 Bridgestone RE-01R will be available. One of the local STS2 autocrossers brought a pre-release set he got from Bridgestone to a recent event, and several of the faster cars in that class tried them out (CRX Si and Miatas). These cars have been set up for the 205/50-15 Azenis and dialed in on that tire for the last two years. They mounted the Bridgestone and went 1.5 to 2 seconds faster on a 55 second course with no adjustments. That's huge, and the Azenis is great tire. We were all stunned.

If you have a chance, wait for them to come out in the next month or so.

Scott
90SM

 

Cool. I can wait...

Thanks.

 

First of all, I'd like to say BIG thanks to all that have replied and a special thanks to minihune who seems to have answered these questions several times before(oops).

This next set of questions is directed to minihune:
You're recommending 205/55/15 over the 195/55/15..
The 205 has more tread width but the 195 has a slightly lower sidewall.
1) Which one is better for braking? Bigger contact patch or lower sidewall and less weight?(one of the tire size calculators mentioned a greater than 3% change in overall wheel diameter can affect braking ability)

2) WHICH tire size and WHAT tire traits favor grip/stability/response over the other?

3) Someone above mentioned wheel wobbling as a possibility on 205s. It seems for your 205s, it is not an issue. But because of the extra tread width, did you add extra psi to the tires to accommodate for this "rolling" and how would a change in tire sizes influence the optimum level air pressure required in the tires for normal operation/spirited driving/track?

4) I am considering the BFGoodrich G-force sports in both sizes. Have you tried these on your wheels and does it have good sidewall support?(I read good reviews about this one but only a few remarked about its mediocre sidewall support)

5) (not related) Fix a Flat. I heard if left on for too long it can damage aftermarket rims and perhaps OEM ones too. Additionally, on back of the can it warns against using the product on tires that have tire pressure monitoring systems. Is this safe or good idea to use? Others who have MCSs w/out runflats may not know.

6) And I feel I have to ask this just in case: Do I have to worry about rubbing on the wheel well and warranty issues?

Oh and I intend on using them for commuting and leisure. I live in LA with little rain and moderate temperatures, so I would like to have summer/HP tires on year round.

If there are any other tires to recommend other then what you have mentioned above and take the time to answer ALL my questions, myself along with everyone else will be very greatful and (if not already) declare you the definitive Tire Guru of NAM! And all who oppose will be put on cinder blocks

 

It's good to get a lively discussion going. For even more information try calling Alex@tirerack.com.

1) Both are OK for braking, not that much difference, maybe slight edge to the lighter tire if mounted on the same wheel and using the same tire. There is more to be gained in brake distance from considering which tire to select, size is not the big question.
2) Tire size that favors handling- usually going to be lower profile and anything with a larger contact patch so 225/45 is better than 195/55. But you also get rougher ride quality as a result. Tire traits? Other things to consider for better handling- rubber compound (soft and sticky but wears much faster), tread design (makes a difference for cornering and in the wet),
Directional vs non directional tread- ask Alex@tirerack.com for more info.
3) I have no wheel wobble with 205/50-15 and for street use always us the standard stock psi of about 34-37. On the track with any street tires not just these you can increase tire pressure a little, few psi but I usually just keep them at 37-38 psi front and rear.
4) BF Goodrich g-Force Sports are OK tires. I don't think I have mentioned them at all in this thread yet. Reread the suggested tires and compare them head to head against the g-Force Sport. Is there a particular reason you are looking at them over other choices? Earlier you mentioned Falken ZE512.
5) Fix a Flat- ask Alex, I don't use it. I do standard flat repairs.
6) Rubbing is not a problem. Once you replace your stock tires the warranty on the tires is from the manufacturer of the tire. Your MINI warranty should be ok unless the dealership can prove and mounting non stock tire sizes directly caused a problem which isn't true unless at the same time you took apart something else like the suspension or brakes.

Further, at the time of mounting the new tires you can do a four wheel thrust alignment and set it to factory specs.

OK, so the big question is which tire then determine the size that fits.
Reread everything in this thread, there are alot of very good tires mentioned.
Look at your budget. Don't pass over the all season tires because they aren't summer tires. While you do give up a little in handling you gain in ride comfort and treadlife.

I would still suggest the Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3 even though it is a little shorter on outer tire diameter, it's just a very good summer tire. Last time I checked it was on back order. Confused? Talk to Alex.

 

Ok, looking at
BF Goodrich g-Force Sport in 195/55-15
It's pretty good on tirerack tests-
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...ay.jsp?ttid=78
vs Avon Tech M500 it did well, a bit more sporty but not as comfortable.

If we look at Ultra HP Summer tires in 195/55-15
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/survey...ireSearch=true
At the top of the customer ratings and going down are-

General Exclaim UHP (good traction very good comfort, good daily driver tire) $55 each
380 treadwear V speed rated 17 lbs
Michelin Pilot Exalto PE2 (costs more but very good overall) $109 special price
240 treadwear V speed rated 18 lbs
BF Goodrich g-Force Sport $75 each
340 treadwear V speed rated 20 lbs
Kumho Ecsta SPT $62 closeout
340 treadwear V speed rated 19 lbs
Avon Tech M500 $61 each
280 treadwear W speed rated 20 lbs

In 205/55-15 same UHP summer tires:

Michelin Pilot Exalto PE2 $116 special price
240 treadwear W speed rated 20 lbs
BF Goodrich g-Force T/A KDW2 $107 each
300 treadwear W speed rated 22 lbs
Bridgestone Potenza RE750 $93 each
340 treadwear W speed rated 22 lbs
BF Goodrich g-Force Sport $79 each
340 treadwear V speed rated 20 lbs

All of the above tires are quite decent for general use. I don't think you have to worry that much about slight differences except some are a bit better on comfort.

If you want better handling then consider
BF Goodrich g-Force T/A KDW2 (not so good on comfort)
Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3

The trick is to find balance between handling and comfort with some value (if that is a factor).
More street comfort means usually not as good handling and vice versa. Better handling usually means faster wear. But if you drive hard on a basic tire you won't get the handling you want and you may wear the tire out faster anyway.

 

Don't forget about the Falken Azenis RT-615 (205/50/15) and the Hankook Ventus R-S2 Z212 (195/50/15, 205/50/15, 225/45/15 and 225/50/15). Both top level tires (with a nod to the Falkens). Both not available from TireRack. But 90STX is right, the soon to be released 'stones are the best if you can find 'em.

EdgeRacing sells the above tires. www.edgeracing.com

 

Comfort and leisure sure sounds more like Grand Touring tires or HP summer tires maybe.

I know you stated you want more peroformance than the stock Contis.

If we go back to post #3 these are quite good choices for you:

In 195/60-15 in Ultra High Perf All Season class
Bridgestone Potenza RE960AS $68 400 treadwear H speed rated
21 pounds 24.2" outer tire diameter
Kumho Ecsta ASX $45 420 treadwear V speed rated
19 pounds 24.2" outer tire diameter

In 205/55-15 Grand Touring All Season
Bridgestone Turanza LS-V $125 closeout price 400 treadwear V speed rated
23 lbs, 24" outer tire diameter.
Test results
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/...ay.jsp?ttid=75

Also in the same class (with many sizes for 15" and 16")
see survey results-
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/survey....jsp?type=GTAS
Check out the Goodyear Eagle ResponsEdge
195/55-15 $113 440 treadwear V speed rated 22 lbs 23.4" tire diam
195/60-15 $95 440 treadwear H speed rated 23 lbs 24.2" tire diam
205/60-15 $98 440 treadwear H speed rated 23 lbs 24.7" tire diam $95 440 treadwear H speed rated 23 lbs, 24.2" outer tire diameter.

Grandtouring All Season gives you much better handling than the contis with smooth comfortable ride with long treadlife and moderately reasonable prices.
These are solid tires for general street use.

HP summer tires don't get the same high customer ratings
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/survey...ay.jsp?type=HP
Nor do Grand Touring Summer tires-
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/survey...ay.jsp?type=GT

Want more performance than the Grand Touring AS? Then consider the Ultra HP AS Bridgestone Potenza RE960AS. Don't let the All Season class sway you, it's a good "compromise" for daily street driving and comes in 195/60-15 for only $68 each.

Falken ST615 and Hankook Z212 tires are very good on handling and well suited for track, autocross, and performance driving but not comfortable and quiet for daily use. Some of those sizes (225/45 or 225/50) best fit 15x7 rims not stock 15" rims

 

You would be better off getting inexpensive wider wheels and cheap tires, than using an expensive tire on the too-heavy, too-narrow, pretty-awful stock wheels.

Besides, you would have to keep throwing your money down the drain replacing inappropriate tires and getting mediocore results, while buying better wheels only happens once. 16x7" wheels would also give you access to a much wider selection of tires...

 

Good point.

All MINI owners have a choice-
Stick with the MINI stock wheels of whatever they have got.
17x7 nice but heavy
16x6.5 nice and moderate on weight- usable for most owners
15x5.5 nice looking (MINI centercaps) and usually fairly light weight and usable for all MC and cabrio owners.

If you keep the rims you keep costs down and can budget more for appropriate tires. You can pick and choose from very high levels of performance down to grand touring. More tires for performance will favor 16" and 17" sizes while more tires for comfort and long treadwear will favor 15" and 16" sizes but there can be exceptions.

Every owner will have to decide if they like the aftermarket look or the MINI OEM look for rims.

Nothing wrong with keeping OEM rims and putting on decently good tires.
I don't favor cheap tires on really nice rims though. Tires are really important and I'd put money into tires first.

16" stock rims with 205/50 or 205/55-16 tires are good for street use.
15" stock rims (my Holeys are 12 lbs each and pretty cheap to find) with 205/55-15 or various sizes in 185 or 195mm widths will work for street driving.

Substitute some 16x7 or 15x7 rims with the same tires and you might do even better, less weight likely but it depends on which rim. Various prices from about $99 per rim on up. Save your stock rims for winter wheels or put them to use at driving school with some sticky tires.

 

I have the Falken Ziex 512's on my 15's now. They are a great tire, good comfort, lower noise on ther street and when whey get nice and hot, stick like glue. However, when hot, they don't give you much warning before they break loose. On my track day at Portland International Raceway, on my 3rd lapping session went into turn 4 hot (just under 80mph), the back end of the car driffed out slightly, no spin, but the pucker factor went from 4 to 10 in a blink of an eye. Very little waning before the slide. Normal opporating temps they scream well in andvance of their break loose point, which is very nice. Tread wear is something like 440 on my 185/65-15 (very near stock size). With about a 12 or so auto-x's, a track day and about 20k on the tires in the last year I'm only half way through the tread. The shoulders on the tires are about gone though, so I guess 3/4 tread wear.

Another greatr point, they shed water like no bodys business. Living in the NW, this is a very good thing. I will be getting another set for winter use when I get a second set of wheels for summer - anybody what to get rid of their R84's?

The ziex 512's are a great tire, I really like them. They work really well and they are inexpensive.

 

thank you for that excelent real-world review of the 512! Looks like they are closing that tire out and replacing it with the 912.

 

Falken ZE512 is an Ultra High Performance All Season tire-
Best for street and certainly decently good in wet weather with very good value.

Taking them on the track or for a Driving school event? Just be careful.
You've giving up some handling for good street manners, treadlife and
value.

 

the most my tires will see is an occasional autoX for fun.

thanks!

 

All you say is very ture. The "ALL SEASON" part of the tire discription kind of contradicts the "ULTRA HIGH PERFORMANCE" part doesn't it?

That is a good point on the HPDE, I did have to watch the pressures, set them to 35f/35r cold and they got up to about 39, max presure is 41, close to the tollerances. Touched 100 to 102mph a few times, max spped rating on the ZE512 is also 130mph, again within the tollerances of the tire. My Cooper won't go 130 unless it's down hill.

It is still a great tire, if I can get my hands on them when I need another set, I won't hesitate to put them back on. just my 2cents.

 

I've been looking for a good street tire for the track in 205/50-15 since the S03PPs became NLA....started out with Kumho MXs--now nationally back ordered (TireRack had ONE in stock which I snapped up as I trashed my left front after 3 track days). Azenis 615 and Kook Z212, the same; nobody's got 'em. Had to get the BFG KDs from Tirerack, which is an older design sticky tire that supposedly sucks big time in the wet. Well, they're on the way and I'll find out.....

Will the new Bridgestones be available in 205/50-15? Man, I sure hope so. Those or the new Yokohama Advan Neova are the way to go.