I'm buying a set of wheels and tires for the track.

My 2007 MCS uses the active TPMS and requires sensors. I believe that if you don't have sensors the TPMS shows an alarm and the warning light comes on.

Therefore, since I will only be using my new wheels and tires on the track, I'm not spending the extra $200 on the sensors.

Am I crazy? Am I going to be sorry?

 

at the track, you will be checking tire pressures before and after each run. i see no need for the sensors. you'll know soon enough if you have a tire going down during a session. i have the older monitoring system in my 06. it has come on several times during track sessions. i pulled in and checked pressures the first three times it happened. i now ignore it unless something doesn't feel right.

 

I'm not so concerned about maintaining proper pressures as I am wondering if I don't have the TPM sensors am I going to have alarms and blinking lights on my dash. I don't THINK I will but I'm just making sure.

Thanks for replying anyway.

Mike

 

STLMini-

I have an '07 Mini with a set of track wheels with no sensors. Like you I couldn't see spending the money on them either. When you put the wheels on it will throw a message that there is a TPMS error and you get a little amber light on the dash... no biggie. It only beeps at you once when you start the car, not continuously. For me, it's no big deal, I don't even notice the light anymore.

Brian

 

You got track pads to stop the track tires? Might think about www.buycarbotechpads.com most MINI Track Fans find the XP10 in the front and XP8 in the rear work best on the OEM setup.

 

Well you have th ABS sensor system, which can activate for other reasons. Mine hasnt activated on the track before. The TPMS is probably useless on a track, because its for detecting the way you set pressures. You are going to feel something before the system goes off if you have a tire issue. Since you should set pressures every chance you get on a track, its not very useful. So long as you aren't negligent, its only useful on the road for detecting slow leaks that you didn't identify. Which in reality the ABS system was perfectly good at the detecting in the first place.

 

Unless all 4 tires experience simultaious pressure loss, this would happen trackside - but over time and seasons on the street.

Alex

 

That's what I'm talking about! Thanks Brian!

 

A somewhat related question for you tire guys:

I bought 4 Mini rims with winter tires for my 08 MCSC. They don't have the TPMS sensors. My estimate is that it would cost $300-$400 to unmount tires, buy & install sensors, remount and balance tires/wheels. I'm feeling cheap. Can I (should I) run without sensors for the 4 months of winter?

Thanks for any advice.

 

Remember what the TPMS system is for... It's for checking tire pressures, not for running the engine. Thier use has been mandated because most drivers never check thier tire pressures and there have been safety issues cause of this. If you've got a tire pressure gauge you don't NEED the sensors, it's that simple.

FWIW, the wheel speed sensor based systems have been ditched because they only notify of changes, but not absolute value. Many drivers just reset the light when it came on (without checking pressures) and ran around with low tire pressures in one or more tire. The newer systems are absolute pressure based and hence are harder to "ignore" if average pressure is down.

Matt

 

You will be fine. There will be a light on your speedo flashing the TPMS indicator. If you were able to drive thru the winter and check your tire pressures without TPMS on older cars, this is no different. The risk is the MCS doesn't have a spare so if you get a flat and your snow tires are NOT runflats you may be SOL. Of course, if you got a flat with TPMS you are dependant on the runflat. Carry a compressor with tire goop.

We have aftermarket wheels and summer tires without TPMS sensors, but the MC has a spare tire..

 

Thanks Dan and Dr. O,

The winter tires are run flats. It sounds like as long as I check the pressure on a regular basis, I should be OK.

 

Well you should run pretty low cold pressures on a track anyways so im sure the system would be having a fit in the first place.

Yeah, so what your saying is we have a government mandate for people who ignore warnings. I don't see how they wont ignore these warnings. It should be illegal to run with low pressures, have cops check every time they pull someone over. At least then they would do something useful.

 

Depends on the tire - Hoosiers like higher pressures.

Indirect senses diameter diffrences. You'd have to have a pretty drastic pressure diffrences between your tires to make it go nuts.

Alex

 

as seatbelts for tires. The point isn't government intervention, it's a realization that there a societal consiquences for the behaviours of many in our society. Sure, if people are stupid it causes them problems so eff em, but then thier act may be one....
That requires emergency responders to act (and we all pay)....
that kills other people (and they pay dearly)....
that causes traffic jam (and we all pay a little bit in time)....

What it comes down to is that a disproportionate amount of traffic deaths come from rollovers, and low tire pressures contribued significantly to roll over accidents.

I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but the notion that single individual acts have no consiquences to others is just niave.

Anyway, absolute TPMS systems are here to stay.... Just like collapsable steering columns, seat belts, ABS and dynamic stabillity control systems. If you don't like it, get an old car.


Matt

 

I was referring to the direct measurement system not liking the cold pressures. Can depend on the tire, but starting with cold pressures of more than 30 is probably too much for the majority of performance tires (hoosier recommends 27-32 psi cold). I have no idea when the TPMS sends off a warning, but that could end up being severely annoying during a track day, but so will running with none.

 

they're designed for the majority (sad to say) of car owners who never really check pressures. More and more drivers have no clue about car maintenance or the like, and are actually surprised that you have to check tire pressures at all! (Oil levels, coolant overflow tanks, brake fluid etc.)

If one has dedicated track tires and wheels, save the money for track fees! If one is an occational track guy who goes with a group and drives on street tires, who really cares if it throws a light throughout the day. If you're not checking your pressures through the day to learn from what they're doing, you're not doing it right in the first place!

Matt

 

Yeah, I'm not so worried about the TPMS checking the pressures. I'm more wondering about the warning and if it's distracting.

 

the first effect is "tunnel vision" where you look out through the windshield, and that's about it. No mirrors, no dash - nothin! Then you remeber to look at the mirrors and the like, and you learn to look way farther ahead than you think you would. That's why things like shift lights are so bright and flash, and are mounted up high, so you can see them in your paripheral vision.

Don't sweat it. You'll be turning your DSC system off anyway, and that will throw a light (leave it on if it's wet out).

Matt

 

Don't know why this question would lead you think that I'm new to track events... but whatever.

I now have my answer as I installed my new wheels yesterday. For those who wonder, here's what happens:

The first time you turn on the car after fitting wheels without TPMs, you will get a TPMS failure message.

The flat tire monitor will blink for a minute or so.

After that you will get the small triangle illuminated on your tach and a constant flat tire monitor warning.

Each time you drive afterwards you will get the audible tone then the blinking flat tire monitor for a minute or so. Once the FTM warning stops blinking it will be on constantly.

Overall, I don't think it will be distracting at all. Just make sure you start you car a couple minutes before you get on the track. Those who are familiar with track events will know that that's not an issue.

I'll probably put some black tape over the light when on the track.

 

is that you acted as though you didn't know it would be a distraction. Seems to me that if you're a track rat, you'd know it wouldn't be. Like having the DSC light on when you track. Or what a pain it is to look down at the dials and gauges any place other than a straight.

Also, you'll see my post said "If" not "You are". That's called a conditional and doesn't mean that I'm saying you are new to track events.

Sorry if you took it the wrong way.... That's not how it was intended.

Matt

 

No problem.

 

Yeah, yeah, old thread, but whatever. I was wondering about this, so thanks! Seems like I should be able to deal no problem for my winter tires.

 

Sorry for brining up an old thread, getting new (used actually) wheels and tires this week with no TPMS. Summer tires are only going to probably last one season so was going to wait for next year when I replace the tires to get a second set of sensors (why pay for installation twice). Was just wondering as far as warning lights, isn't there an option to turn TPMS off in the settings menu, pretty sure there is on mine. If you set TPMS off I thought no warning lights would come on. Does anyone do this, if so what are the results, is it something you have to set once, or at every start up?

 

No option to turn off TPMS.