I went to an open house at Custom Alignment in Mt View, CA. The guys there specialize in high end tire, wheel and alignment work. I learned sooooo much that I didn't know (I think most of the Shelby club in attendance learned a bunch too) about tires, wheels etc. I'll never go to a non-specialist again (and wheel works isn't what I'm talking about...)

Just on mounting tires on wheels. What was the latest and best makes sure that no metal ever touches the wheel. Most places don't have this equipement. There's a new machine out (came out about a year ago at SEMA) where nothing but the tire touches the wheel. Learned a lot about seating the wheel onto the bead, etc.

Balancing. Have to have the right machine. The one they use does a lot, it will even measure the differences in sidewall stiffness (and there is some). This difference will allow one side to press harder on the road than the other side, and can result in a push one way or the other. The machine will measure all the tire,wheel combos, so you can always rotate in such a way that these effects cancle, as much as possible. It will also determine out of round of the wheel and tire, and if there's too much, you can rotate the tire relative to the wheel if needed, to cancle out the effects. The demo wheel tire combo (17x9 Mustang cobra rims, with 295-35 r 17 tires) would have gone from needing about 1.5 oz of weight, to almost none it they'd done this. The machine can also be told where the spokes are, so that the weights are placed behind the spokes, so you don't see them. The owner was talking about balancing some tire wheel combos for a Mallet Corvette that averaged 186 MPH in one of the Nevada speed races, with top speeds over 210, and the driver had never felt anything like it. For that app, they did the rotation of the wheel vs the tire, then lathed the assembly to be perfectly round, and then checked to see if the balance needed fine tuning. They do the same for the Bonneville cars they work on.

I asked about run flats. everyone admits they're getting better, but the way the work is stiff sidewall. He commented about the Mini specifically, and said that most of the shortcoming with the stock tires is that they're a bit stiff, but that the compoud is chosen for long life, and that degrades maximum traction. As more performance rubber is used for the treads of the run flats, they will get better from a performance perspective.

also learned that optical pyrometers can steer you wrong, as air cooling of the tire is fast at the surface. For the Mustangs most of the club members use, the front air dam leves the outer front edge more exposed, and this cools that part first. There are pyrometers that you push into the tread. They reccomend at least 1/8" penetration to get better numbers.... Also, if you road race, and do cool down laps at club events, you don't really measure the tire temps as they are when hot lapping....

they went on and on and on.... Too much to remember. But if you live in the Bay Area, they are a shop to keep in mind. They beta test new alignement rigs for the manufacturers, and were the #1 Tire Rack installer in 3 of the last 10 years, out of over 2000. They are a 5 star tire rack installer. And the fancy balencer machine can flag tires that are bad, and they get them replaced BEFORE you leave the shop.

Anyway, it was a good day, and TonyB, you missed a very educational event. (And the BBQ for lunch was amazing as well, and the whole deal was free!)

Matt

 

That sounds incredible! If you hear about another open house event at Custom Alignment, please let us all know - I, for one, would be interested in attending.

 

I had my tires mounted on some rims there, and they were incredibly professional about everything--as in the guy who was busy balancing tires came all the way across the shop and restacked my rims because he saw them leaning slightly to one side, which I couldn't see. The average grease monkey would've turned the other way. That and using low profile weights without me asking, all for a good price, along with speedy service, will make me a repeat customer.

 

It really was an amazing day. The aligment machine they use is one that uses computer vision system, and measures the parameters for each wheel with over 50,000 images! Not only do you get all the alignment specs for each wheel, but you also get frame information (wheel base and diagonals).

There was a prototype machine that was sent back to the manufacturer (not ready for prime time... yet), that puts each corner through suspension travel and measures are the wheel arcs as well, and stuff like bumpsteer....

It will be nice when that one is ready to use as well.

Matt

 

Damn.......! I hate living out in the boonies.

Nice write up. Any chance of posting the manufactures and models of equipment used so we folks not in the bay area can ask around locally?

 

Custom Alignment has a website, and their equipment is listed here: http://www.customalignment.com/equipment.htm. Hunter has a directory of locations with the Road Force balancer: http://www.gsp9700.com/.

 

interesting finds ... I can totally recommend the Hunter gsp9700 balancer machine ... it finally found what 2 other shops with common balancers could not ... 3 minor bends in some old wheels I had.

 

This is perfect......THANKS !

 

When Corvettes first came out with the run-flat tires, they had huge balance issues. And the dealers in the area didn't have a balancer that could diagnose the problem. So Custom Alignment had a blanket PO open from the local chevy dealer, and every Corvette they sold went through CA's shop to have the tires checked and balanced. Many tires were sent back as defective. Many of the Corvette customers who had vibration problems were sent straight to CA for diagnosis. After a bit, and the chevy dealer saw what they were spending, they bought there own road force aligner, and that was the end of a very nice revenue stream.

Matt

 

Great write up.

Thanks for the link, rkw. I know where I'll have my next set of tires mounted and balanced. There are several in my area.

 

For those in the St. Louis area, I highly recommend Combs Tire and Auto in Kirkwood. They have a RoadForce, too. I had them mount and balance my new tires from TireRack, for whom they're a preferred installer.

 

It won't start the test process until the units own air hose it attached to the tire, to set air pressure in the tire to a pre-set level (they used 40 lbs for the 295-35 tire used for the demo).

Pretty neat!

Matt

 

wow Thanks for sharing the info with the rest of us.

 

I just called them up to let them know that some Mini people may be calling. They're happy to help.

Matt

 

Thanks Doc! Nice follow up.

 

From the cheap place, they were told to get it at -2 deg front camber, -1 rear camber, and 1/16 front toe....

The before reading from CA was...

-1.8 left front camber
-2.4 right front camber
-1/16th left front toe
1/16th right front toe

-3.1 rear camber left and right
3/32nd left rear toe
1/8th right rear toe

After (I told them how I wanted to drive, and they came up with the numbers)
-2.2 left and right front camber
1/32nd left and right front toe
-1.3 left and right rear camber
0 left and right rear toe.

And this was with weights in the car to mimic my weight.

FWIW.

Matt