Yes, I know Tire Rack has them, but that's not what I mean. Has anyone tried these latest Michelin tires out on their Mini Cooper? They sound like very good all season tires, with good online reviews, perhaps well worth the extra dollars they cost. It would be reassuring to know, from a user here, if that's really the case. My Yokohama Avid H4S tires are going bald. They have been good tires, especially as far as ride comfort, better than average in snow and ice, and a big all around improvement over the factory Conti tires I had on before. They only lasted me a year though, which was a little disappointing, based on their treadwear rating. I'd like to do better all around with whatever my next set of tires will be.

 

Quieter and quicker cornering . 45k

Alex

 

May I suggest the Pilot Exalto PE2?

Wonderful tire. An aquired taste; they feel unresponsive, and they are a little. I believe the tread moves around a bit, not the sidewall - based on wear at the track.

These tires have an unbelievable amount of wet grip - waaaay more than the ES 100 or Kumho 712. They are also noticably grippier on dry roads. They are probably slightly less resistent to hydroplaning than the above two, but not by much at all. They are extremely quiet and very comfortable. And, after one day at LRP, there was barely any wear on the driver's side front tire - set at 34psi cold - 40 psi hot.
The PE2s were also very very forgiving at the track - they break away very slowly with lots of feel. This characteristic extends to the street too.

The PE2s are not directional so I would expect these to last longer than the other two above given the rotation options.

I think these are great tires; they give up a little responsiveness to the other two above, but more than make up for the difference in responsiveness by excelling in every other area. I did not like these when I first installed them. Now I love them! I've put about 200K on the ES100 and the 712 - 400K in total. I would never buy either again. The PE2 is a rock solid tire for every day, albeit more expensive than the other two.

THE PE2 IS NOT AN M/S TIRE! DO NOT DRIVE THIS TIRE IN THE SNOW.

 

The question I have is whether the Michellin Exalto A/S will be a better tire than the Pirelli P-Zero Nero M/S?


Art

 

Hi Meb - I need to PM you about my Cooper - got the rear bar and held off on anything else for now . . . I think billy is in the same boat as me from his post - an MC with stock, holey rims, in which case you can't get the higher perf. pilot PE2 in what I consider the right size - 195/60/15. 205/50/15 may be available, and some may get it mounted on the skinny 5.5 inch width holeys, but I feel its pushing it. The all season exaltos are available in 195/60/15, and at only $87 per corner to boot. On a Cooper with holeys, that might be the best tire out there.

 

Woops, I'm sorry, I may have been a little unclear on a few things when it comes to these tires. While I have 15" (x5.5") OEM 7-hole wheels right now, they will soon (this weekend in fact, or so it seems...if all goes well) be replaced with 16x7" O.Z. (+37mm offset) Ultraleggeras from The Tire Rack. I was planning on getting, and have now ordered, a set of 215/55-16 Michelin Pilot Exalto A/S to wear on these new wheels. This will be for all season street use only. I do not do any track driving of any kind. Not yet anyway, and not likely anytime soon either. (Not that I have anything against such things. My hobbies in life just lead me elsewhere, and I can't afford the helmet for it anyway...not after buying all this other Mini upgrade stuff! LOL)

This set of tires is being specifically bought to give me about the best I can get, in an all season tire, as far as wet/dry cornering and traction, as well as ride comfort (relatively speaking, of course...to keep Mini rattles down to a minimum), and provide near snow tire traction...in a non-dedicated snow tire package that will be wearable all year long, with a high treadwear rating. The various online reviews of this tire seem to indicate that it will do so for me, better than the Yokohamas, which were pretty good...for the most part. The very large diameter tire diameter, of about 25.3", is meant to give me the most ground clearance I can achieve...w/o having any rubbing issues.

Although the applicable charts, which can be linked to elsewhere on the forum, seem to indicate that 215/55-16 tires will not rub, and that they will fit a 16x7" wheel...I'm still not absolutely certain. I will find out this coming Saturday, and...assuming the fit issue turns out well...I will give a little review of my own impression of these tires. We still have some snow up here, and a bit more is expected that weekend, a little later that evening in fact...after the install, so I'll have a good opportunity to check these tires out, right away. (I'm not sure if there is a break-in period for tires, so I may have to take it easy, at first, but I've got a few long road trips coming up the following weekends, so I'll still get a good chance to push them fairly soon, including some trips over the mountains.)

Right now, I just hope the tires fit the wheels okay, and that the wheels fit the car okay, and that there are no rub issues. I also hope to never bottom out ever again, on dry pavement, or especially on rutted snow covered side streets, at least not w/o trying real hard to do so! LOL

I forget where I found the information (likely hidden away somewhere at The Tire Rack site), but I'm pretty sure these tires, in this approximate size, weigh about 22.5 lbs. each. The O.Z. wheels weigh 14.5 lbs. Which means I will not be gaining, or losing, much in the way of combined wheel/tire weight, compared to what I had previously. I'll be getting a taller, wider set up though, and I expect I'll like what the extra width will do for me in cornering. I'm not sure if a wider tire helps at all with ride quality.

Anyway, thank you very much for the responses. At least I've not heard anything negative, so that's a good sign, right?

 

I have no experience with the All Season Exaltos. However, if these are of the same 'cloth', they should be a very nice tire; beautiful breakaway, quiet, comfortable and more grip wet or dry than a sane person can utilize on public roads. $87.00 is about $80.00 less expensive than the PE2s...wow.

 

In this size, 215/55-16, these are running me about...$130 a tire. I wasn't able to find out about what kind of discount I may be able to get at The Tire Rack, and so that's about what I'll be paying through my local Big O Tires, by way of The Tire Rack.

I probably screwed up when it comes to that, and that bugs me a little, but that's how things stand right now.

 

Just make sure your rim size is optimized for that tire size; There are usually three sizes for each tire size. The middle size is typically the optimized size.

 

I've never seen or heard anything about there typically being 3 tire sizes recommended for each particular wheel size. I know the tires I'm getting are not the "recommended" size, but neither were the larger Yokohamas I went with to replace my factory rubber. Those tires worked out pretty well, for what I wanted them for, with no real issues. So...I'm not sure about the "middle" recommended tire size necessarily being optimal, at least for my purposes. Probably, I suppose that makes sense, and would likely be true, but I'm not sure how much of a difference there is between optimal, and less than optimal.

Unfortunately, I changed my my on wheels this morning, to the Superleggeras, as opposed to the previously decided upon Ultras, so I won't get this set up installed until next week. Too bad, because a snow storm is arriving as I type this! LOL (It's not too bad a storm, so I hopefully won't crash my Mini between now and next week.)

 

Every tire has a minimum, best and then maximum wheel width relationship - in that order.

For example...hopefully I get this correct for my tire size, but if not, you'll get the idea. My 205/45/17s are ideally suited to a 7.5" rim. They'll work on a 7" and an 8"...they'll also fit a 6.5" or an 8.5" rim. I wrote fit, I did not write work. A tire's performance is based upon many things. One of these is the characteristic of the side wall. If a given tire is mounted on a rim too wide, the sidewall will stretch too far causing the potential for the shoulders to distort - protrude below the center of the contact patch - essentially asking part of the sidewall to become the shoulder. If the same tire is mounted on a wheel too narrow, the side wall will lift a portion of the tread - at the shoulders - off the ground. Wheels should optimize the contact patch and performance characteristics of a given tire.

Wheel width affects the tire's contact patch characteristics; it is either optimized or compromised. The difference depends upon the tire and how it is driven. A side wall should be stretched a hair if it is to offer consistent high performance. The two examples that I site as a compromise will eventually cause the tire to over heat at high speeds.

 

As far as I can tell, and as far as I've been told, thus far, the 215/55-16 tires should work, rather than just fit. The issue had been checked into recently, since there was a question in my mind regarding the subject, but I've no definitive answer, other than the tires will fit well within range, and should not be a problem in that specific regard. That, according to my local tire/wheel shop. Their major concern was with if there might be tire rubbing issues, but research here says there shouldn't be the case at all, considering overall tire diameter and width.

Despite all that, I'm not 100% certain that this will all work out as it seems it should on paper, since I keep finding out new things about all of this with each day that passes. One wheel, with tire mounted, will be put on the car, before any of the other wheels are mounted, just to make sure of suffiicient tire clearance.

 

Sorry, I'd also meant to add that this tire size (215/55-16) in question has a 6-7.5" rim width range. So, in your opinion, would you consider that something that will work, or just something that will fit? It seems like that should be fairly optimal for a 16x7" rim, or even a 16x6.5" rim, but what do you think?

 

If you're compelled to have an A/S...

You definitely don't want the Exalto A/S then. The Michelin Pilot A/S kills it in Michelin's own ratings. Check Michelin's website for their ratings and you'll see. The Exalto A/S had very poor wet ratings compared to the Pilot A/S. If it's mileage you're looking for, the Exalto A/S is a better choice, but it would certainly take the wind out of the fun driving sails 365 days a year. Michelin rates both high in snow traction, but I'd be suspect of that if you've ever driven on true winter tires. A true winter tire literally throws the snow out of the tread. It looks like the spray you get from an outboard motorboat at speed.

I have friends here in Germany with Dunlop 5000 A/S tires. Whwen we drive to work in the snow, I don't have any snow buildup on the rear of the fender wells, and they do. Just shows how efficient winter tires are in ejecting the snow out of the tread.

More on winter tires...

At the 2005 Frankfurt autoshow, I asked the tire manufacturers about their A/S tires as I was trying to decide upon an A/S for winter use of a dedicated winter tire (I defintely knew my summer Dunlops would not see winter duty). Anyway, every tire manufacturer present said the same thing, "there's no such thing as an A/S tire." Here in 4-season Germany, a switch to winter tires every November is the prefered action among the masses. In fact, the use of dedicated winter tires will become law next year. Winter tires already account for 25% of all tire sales in Germany. Ultimately my advice is to have two sets (summer and winter), depending on the climate you live in.

 

BillyB and StevieB,

The Pilot series includes all the tires we are discussing. The Pilot PS2 is the tire I really wanted, but it is not available in a true plus sizing for the Mini.

The Exalto PE2 becomes the next best tire down the ladder, then the Exalto Sport A/S and then Exalto A/S. So StevieB is correct, look at the Exalto sport A/S...unless there is sizing difficulty.

I wrote the first review on Tire Rack's web site for the Exalto PE2...wish I had checked my grammer and spelling...

 

Great, now I'm really confused. I'm not sure, but I think it might be just a bit late in the game to change tires, but I'll look up those tires, and see if any of those others are in my desired tire size.

 

The Michelin Pilot Sport A/S is available from The Tire Rack in 215/55-16, but I'm not all that impressed with it's reviews, compared to the Pilot Exalto A/S, especially for the greater cost. Of course, the reviewers of the Sport are a somewhat different bunch from the reviewers of the Exalto, but some of the Exalto reviewers had the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S before, and none of them seemed incredibly overjoyed with that tire, in comparison. Many of the reviewers of both these tires are often times reviewing using their OEM factory tires, that came with their vehicles, as a baseline. That's not very helpful, as most tires factory equipped on cars are not very stellar performers. As I discovered in comparing the Mini's factory Conti tires against the Yokohama H4S tires. Where there was little comparison. The Yokohamas were clearly superior, but what does that say about how they compare to a more competitive aftermarket tire? Not necessarily very much. Still, these various reviews, and opinions here, as well as practical spending constraints, etc., are all I have to go on.

Having a dedicated Summer wheel/tire set up, and a completely different Winter wheel/tire arrangement...is simply not very practical for me, though I certainly wouldn't mind, if I had the space, and/or the money, to do so. I don't though, so that option doesn't even come into the picture, at least for me. I have to deal with some snow/ice driving here in Reno (and the surrounding area) just a few days out of the year, usually. Roads here are not generally great, but they are okay...more or less. I do some moderate dirt road driving. Rain is not common here, though we certainly get some, but wet roads, from snow/ice melt off, are very common in Winter, and not uncommon in the mountains all year long. I do not race, but I certainly enjoy the twisties. Most of my driving is in the city, and somewhat spirited in nature. I live in an approximately 500 square foot studio apartment, with an "open air" parking space, and I currently make about $25K a year, nearly 1/4 of which goes to paying for/maintaining my Mini.

Okay, obviously I'm willing to spend, to a certain degree, on my car, for good results, so I don't know why I bothered mentioning that last bit. LOL I just wanted to let you know where I'm coming from in trying to decide on these things. It's not easy. I'm already spending more than I should, but I've already learned that there are times when I had better spend some extra money on my Mini, or I end up suffering, one way or another, later on down the road.

And now my damn CV transmission is acting up on me, sheesh!

*sigh*

Oh well, I've got an appoinment, for some other things, with my dealership, this coming Saturday, so that's just one more little issue I'll need to tell them about before I get there. I hope they can deal with the problem, otherwise I'm going to end up feeling rather stupid for putting all this extra money in a car...that I may have to end up selling, if I don't feel I can depend on it. At least I'll probably be able to sell it a little easier, eh...if I have to? LOL

 

BillyB,

Stick with the Exalto A/S. If you're not inclined to really hammer the car every day, your needs are different than, say mine for example. That doesn't make your choice wrong...in fact, if you follow me, you'll be making the wrong choice for you. The only other advice; pick a tire that suits your driving style and the bulk of the conditions you drive in.

I have dedicated set of snow tires/wheels and track tires/wheels and I'm constantly being pecked at by my other half about space...in a garage that she never uses

 

Anybody have an opinion whether the Michelin Pilot Exalto A/S is worth the premium over the BFG Sport? I want something that grips well but am also interested in a quiet ride for my cabrio.

 

I am currently running those tires at 205/50R16 and I like how they handle and they are quiet.


Art

 

Here's a great compairison.

Alex

 

Alex, your link is broke.

 

I ordered a set yesterday - 205/55/15 for my Konig Rewinds. Should have them on the car next week sometime. I'll report back...

 

Migrations - sorry about that, fixed now!

Alex

 

Hey BucketHead, how do you like your new Pilot Exalto A/S tires? I have Rewinds arriving today and need to decide on tires.