You could very well be rite but I am GUESSING that if the motor does not run at as high a temperature before it will not need to cool down from as high a temp as before and there for will not stay as hot for as long a time as before.Seems " logical " to me . In any event the baking effect is merely a side note to the more beneficial cooler running of the motor. It's ALL GOOD

Randy
eam M7

www.m7tuning.com

 

Brilliant!!!..


of course when the airflow stops the temp will rise until it is cooled by the fan which will turn on somewhere around 200 degrees f....



next prediction from Trippy.. the sun will rise in the east..

 

I just re read your prediction and realized that one was already proved wrong by the almighty numbers When i used the term " baking " i was referring to the situation when the car is turned off and allowed to cool down which in reality actually heats up and then cools down SLOWLY.

Your prediction

"Since the radiator fan will turn on and off at the same temperature as before I am going to predict that the coolant temperatures will rise just as high as with a higher temperature thermostat installed when the car is not moving and is running."

Our previously mentioned facts.

5. Idle with A/C Mini thermostat = 214 degrees M7 Thermostat =
185 degrees
Delta = 29 degrees

Idle = when the car is moving and not running.

Anyway thanks for the post glad to have you and Andy playing along . It can get a little slow on here without you guys , thanks for the support and happy fourth of july

Randy
Team M7

www.m7tuning.com

 

You know, it can't hurt, right? For $29 the only drawback would be if it's a pain in the *** to install. Hey, Randy, how about the installation instructions (or did I miss them in the thread?). Thanks!

 

I'd LOVE to win $0.25 from the M7 team. I think they'd LOVE to win a bet from me.

I will be completely willing to admit I was wrong after I see TonyB's data.

Test situation: car sitting still idling. AC off.

I think it will show coolant temperature cycling at between 200 and 220 degrees F

Do you predict temperature cycling at 185 degrees F?

Just so we know what we're predicting.

 

I will gladly do so! I wish I could see jlm's photo before I commit though (I get that same "warning" as above when I attempted to see Randy's)... I hope this won't be a full-day project full of frustrations...

I sort of agree with Trippy. I think we will still see the "baking" effect. My intuition says though that since the start temp (prior to baking) will be lower, we will not see the same high elevations. In a relative sense, yes, but the peaks, like the valleys should be less, and if true, that is certainly a positive.

Fun stuff! Hope everyone has a fun and safe 4th...

 

if your all woried about idle temps so much why dont you install a digital temp read out in the car and an override switch for the radiator fan so you can turn it on whenever u see necessary?

 

The how to without pictures......


1. Open hood

2. Remove CAI or stock plastic housing

3. Remove Computer module from housing, to remove connectors slide
the tabs away from connector

4. Remove lower portion of cold air box and cold air tube from the front of
the vehicle.

5. Disconnect the wiring harness in front of thermostat housing (don't worry
it can only go back one way).

6. locate the 3 bolts on the thermostat housing, unbolt, pull the T-housing
out remove white gasket and thermostat. Now carefully separate the
gasket from the OE thermostat.

7. Insert the M7 180 degree thermostat in the original gasket, reverse the
six previous steps....Voila

I would highly recomend to do this when the car is cold as the cooling system
will not be pressurized.
When you are finished with the install it is of outmost importance to refill all the fluids and to make sure that there is no air pockets in the system.

Warning
If you are not 100% sure you can do this procedure "Don't do it"
Make your self a favour, take the car to your favourite tuner/shop
and let them do the job.

For any technical questions feel free to call any time :smile:

peter
562-712-3270
Team M7

www.m7tuning.com

 

here is another pic seen from the bottom with the head removed from the block. by the way, bleeding the air out of the cooling system can be pesky.(the pic loads for me when i click the link, windows xp)

(just noticed the themostat housing is rotated in the pic incorrectly)

 

It appears that there are a few people who have been recording data from their MINIs.

Here's another chart of an MCS running.

The temp stays AMAZINGLY close to 195 during the run. I'm pretty sure the 180-degree F thermostat will bring that right down around 180 degree-F.

And once again, once the vehicle is not moving, the temps go right up to the radiator-fan turn -on temp of something in the neighbordood of 210 degrees F.

No bets so far on how the 180 degree thermostat will affect that.

 

unfortunately.. it does not load for me.. xp/dsl...

says i dont have permission...


who shall grant that?

 

i bet it will have no effect on that at all....

when you are not cooling the car via motion.. i think the engine will heat up to the level that the computer will turn the fan on..

unless of course it's really cold outside.....



the temp guage on the mini.. does not move much.. on mine.. i see it go up to almost the halfway mark.... just kiss it.. and then drop back a small amount..

I have never seen it higher than the halfway mark on any of it's 5 track days.. and since I only got the car in December and I live at the beach.. the ambiant temp has not been much above 80..

we shall see...

 

those are the first pics i have posted on this site, and then only since the new format. I have no idea about permission settings???

 

Did I miss it or does anyone know what temp the fans come on? I don't think they wait for 195 to come on. When cruising the fans are barely needed anyway and I believe the car would run at 180. I think this mod is a great idea and worth trying. I know my car runs better before it get to full temp. flexalite makes an adjustable switch that you can set the temp to. Also most fans turn on with the A/C even if the car is not at full temp.

 

The attachment photos now appear as thumbnails on my work laptop (Windows 2K). The same as my home desktop with XP. Very strange...

Thanks for the How-To Peter, and jlm for the photos. I'll give it a shot, but it seems that I might need some help bleeding the air out of the system though. Once I'm convinced that I can do this, I will gladly try the M7 thermostat.

It seems that with the charts provided, we have a good idea of how the stock thermostat works. Thanks Trippy. That last guy was driving a bit fast!

M7, thanks for the novel idea, so simple, yet over-looked, until now. Even if this only drives down average operating temps (180 instead of 195), this will probably be seen as worthwhile to quite a few folks, minus those MINI brethren in rather cool environments...

 

The temp gauge on the MINI is a dummy gauge. The middle line stands for something like 180-260 degrees. In other words, normal operating temps. If that needle ever goes past that point, you're in BIG TROUBLE - I guarantee you're gonna overheat (prob b/c your power steering fan blew and your engine fan won't turn on )

 

for what it's worth, i have an autometer temp gauge and the car stabilizes at 215+ in city driving; the fan comes on if it gets hotter or if I turn on the AC, and that will drop the temps to 195, city.

what is the best way to post a jpg photo? some post full size, some thumnails...what's up with that? what file size?

 

I live in LA (Louisiana ). As such, my mini has never experienced conditions that included running without the AC on (yes even in winter). Maybe that's why my fan seems to come on 30 secs after start-up

 

If you really want to watch your temperatures, use the odometer readout trick - You can watch a real-time digital display of the temp. in Centigrade.

• With ignition off, press and hold the odometer reset button while turning the ignition key to the first position, then release.
• Display will show "_ _ 1.0_ tESt_"
• Press/release 3 times (I think)
• Display will show "_ 19.0_ tESt_"
• Wait 5 seconds or so and display will start to alternate readings -
• "_ 19.0_ L_oFF" to "_ 19.0_ L_oN_"
• Press/release when display is "_ 19.0_ L_oFF" (meaning it's turning the full menu lockout off which will display more items)
• Display will instantly return to "_ _ 1.0_ tESt_"
• Press/release until you see "_ _ 7.0_ tESt_"
• Wait 5 seconds or so and display will shift to display engine temperature in Centigrade. Interesting note, here, if your MINI has been sitting for a while, the initial display will be the temperature when you last turned the ignition off - mine was 101 from the previous day. When you start the engine, the display will show the current temperature.
• The display will show "_ _ 7.0_ _ _###" (# being a number)
• Press/release again and you'll get 7.1 which is ambient temperature
• Susequent presses will show RPM (7.2) and Instant Speed in Kilometers/hour (7.3) then cycle back to 7.0

Drive around for awhile and you can watch how quickly your engine temperature climbs and compare the temp gauge position to the actual temp. I haven't tried it, but you might even be able to figure out when the radiator fan cycles on and off.

Caution! You're responsible for any adverse consequensus that result from driving while pressing buttons and staring at the display. I recommend doing that as a passenger, that way you can take notes, pictures, etc.

Enjoy

 

Peter, at what temperature does the mini leave the "choke loop" and will the lower temp opening of the thermostat cause the car to stay in the "choke loop" during winter driving. I have experienced a problem with the ecu on a chevrolet product thinking the engine was still cold (during the winter months) after having a cooler thermostat and "chipping" the ecu. I am not sure if this will be an issue. Tell me what you think....

 

M7,

Thanks for the numbers. It is really good to see this. Now that we have some numbers, and already some ongoing questions, how was the feeling with the new thermostat on. You gave mention that you felt it a little snappier. Could you elaborate? Thanks.

 

As for what I mean by snappier I think i can describe it to you this way. When you first start your car and after it has just warmed up enough to be safe to push it doesn't it feel the fastest just for those few minuets before it reaches normal running temp ? The motor responds a bit more urgently and the car is more aggressive in its acceleration. Kind of like how your car feels faster just after a good rain shower.With the new thermostat that feeling is maintained thru ought the day as the car is running at least 20 degrees cooler than stock.
I went on two canyon driving excursions today and was VERY pleased with the temp readings thru ought the day. I have a auto meter water temp installed which would have been in the 210 range at many times thru the afternoon and I never got over 185. Also I noticed that for the first time at one of the scenic overlooks that we stop at my fan did not come on which it ALWAYS did prior to the 180 F thermostat install. All in all a good day.

Randy
Team M7
WWW.m7tuning.com

 

You have posted twice without taking or rejecting my $0.25 bet that the MINI will have the same coolant temperature when idling without the Air Conditioner on in the "Bake" mode with a stock and an aftermarket thermostat.

You up for a bet or not.

Using TonyB as the tester of course since he produces nice data.

After all, you did say and

I think sitting still with the AC off (of course you don't run the AC if you are concerned about engine temperatures do you?) will show the same temperatures with the stock and non-stock thermostats.

You have made a few claims about the cooling potential, and I think TonyB can validate or invalidate them for us.

(And I'd LOVE to win a $0.25 bet from you folks!)

 

This has already been proven but whatever floats your boat. Actualy it wont have the same temp as it has already been shown to be lower as stated earlier. BTW i don't take checks .

Randy
Team M7
www.m7tuning.com

 

maybe M7 can send a SASE to trippy.

har har